Celestial Navigation with RFB / TMO mods? - Page 2

aanker · 06-13-17, 12:50 PM

I have modded my own game, fixing and fine tuning many things. The Spyron mod I like to use won't be compatible with FOTRS due to circumstances beyond my control.

If you send me the F1 in-game Help file, it would be easy to add the three Tabs (pages) from greyrider's mod to it.... or you could easily add them yourself - it is a copy paste operation and renumbering the 'chapters' and paragraphs in them with find replace.

Some of the SH4 Help file isn't helpful so I combined some of it and managed to free up 3 pages for the Celestial/Almanac data. That work wasn't necessary but I didn't want Tabs scrolling down the F1 page.

Happy Hunting!

propbeanie · 06-13-17, 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aanker

...
Some of the SH4 Help file isn't helpful so I combined some of it and managed to free up 3 pages for the Celestial/Almanac data. That work wasn't necessary but I didn't want Tabs scrolling down the F1 page.

Happy Hunting!

Heresey! ~Hare-ess-SEA~!!!

- About the only times I've used the Help is when I accidentally hit the F1 key, and it then it takes me a while to figure out how to close it...

- Your idea there is a good one. Actually have a use for hitting that F1 key...

Bubblehead1980 · 06-13-17, 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aanker

I have modded my own game, fixing and fine tuning many things. The Spyron mod I like to use won't be compatible with FOTRS due to circumstances beyond my control.

If you send me the F1 in-game Help file, it would be easy to add the three Tabs (pages) from greyrider's mod to it.... or you could easily add them yourself - it is a copy paste operation and renumbering the 'chapters' and paragraphs in them with find replace.

Some of the SH4 Help file isn't helpful so I combined some of it and managed to free up 3 pages for the Celestial/Almanac data. That work wasn't necessary but I didn't want Tabs scrolling down the F1 page.

Happy Hunting!

Would you release this to work with TMO RSRD? This would be a huge help.

propbeanie · 06-13-17, 06:00 PM

I'm trying to get his fingers screwed down to the table, but he keeps squirming away...

I haven't gotten into the Help portion yet to see what he did to that, but if aanker doesn't have the time, I'll be trying it, and will see how different FotRSU is from TMO / RSRDC for that portion. That'll be the hard part. The drawing lines is just tedious - unless those can go in the menu_1024_768.ini also, then they become difficult...

aanker · 06-13-17, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bubblehead1980

Would you release this to work with TMO RSRD? This would be a huge help.

I'll see what TMO & RSRD did with their Help files if anything and attempt to add the three pages of Almanac data. Or, I could send you my Help file. That way you could see what the data looks like before I go through the work of adding and editing them to be compatible with TMO & RSRD. Let me know.

Happy Hunting!

propbeanie · 06-13-17, 07:55 PM

I can either open my Google Drive for an upload, or I'll take a link from you, and do the editing, unless you want to dig into that part of it. PM my PM and they'll do lunch... Unfortunately, keltos01 and I filled up my DropBox, and I can't figure out how to get space back...

some of this new-fangled computer stuff does me in...

DaveR · 06-24-17, 04:19 PM

I missed this moon/sun rise/set from sh1; find this more of a tactical decision making item, than how long the stupid ship sinks.

where are these charts?
thanks

(mod?

: [need a smiley looking at watch])

propbeanie · 06-24-17, 04:28 PM

They're not directly in the game... That's what we're working on, is a substitute for it for a few mods... It will still involve the user having to do some math

DaveR · 06-24-17, 04:34 PM

check

(was looking for and found greywolves download)

aanker · 06-24-17, 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by propbeanie

..... I haven't gotten into the Help portion ...... I'll be trying it, and will see how different FotRSU is from TMO / RSRDC for that portion. That'll be the hard part. The drawing lines is just tedious - unless those can go in the menu_1024_768.ini also, then they become difficult...

Open my Help F1 in-game (maybe in Windowed mode) it is much easier, and edit a copy using a text editor with the FOTRSU Shortcuts and other info you want changed. Then replace mine with your edited Help.cfg file.

Only six or seven lines need to be drawn in a Pearl Pacflt patrol, not tedious at all. From Pearl time it's 4 hours difference from base time to Eastern Japan and 5 hours to Western Japan if that helps put it in perspective.

Draw vertical lines 7.5 degrees E & W of 180d, then every 15 degrees E & W from those 1st two lines. Subtract 1 hour heading W every time you cross a line and add 1 hour heading E. 15d = one hour.

I don't know what keyboard Shortcut commands you are using in FOTRSU. I don't use TMO's or RSRD's keyboard Shortcut commands. You would want to change those in the Help file.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveR

I missed this moon/sun rise/set from sh1; find this more of a tactical decision making item, than how long the stupid ship sinks.

where are these charts?

I missed SH1's calendar's moon/sun rise/set too.

I got them years ago from greyrider's CIC 'Combat Information Center' mod although they are easily found on the internet.

If you PM me your email I can send you my F1 Help.cfg file but I use mostly Stock commands so you would need to edit your shortcuts page as I described above.

DaveR · 06-25-17, 05:49 PM

so last night, got distracted by tv and was brought back to the game with a 'warship sighted'. there in the rising first-q moon was an escorted convoy; [on 12th patrol, July 2, 1943 ~22:00 and this is my first convoy, let alone an escorted convoy]. pissed off, decided this was a good spot to experiment.

so just reading off chart in notepad, I got the following: July 2, 1943 - new moon 12:44 ; July 10, 1943 - f-quarter 16:29. (

I figured this is saying, over the 8 days, the moon goes from new moon to f-quarter, starting at 12:44 and ending at 16:29. but then, the game only has four phases.)

then pulled out for july 2nd and 3rd:
2- mr: 05:00, ms: 19:03, sr: 05:02, ss: 19:05
3- mr: 05:49, ms: 19:49, sr: 05:03, ss: 19:05
(

oops, I was actually looking at "setting" f-quarter moon)

now the fun part: sub is approximately at 140.5w. add in the 7.5 offset, then (180-148 = 32 and divide by 15 = 2.133 or 2:08 hours. then added in offset hour(?), to get a 3:08 correction. which becomes -
2- mr: 0808, ms: 22:57, sr: 08:10, ss: 22:13

loaded game and sun is totally set by 22:43. moon will not be far behind.
So is sun/moon rise when it first peeks out or fully up? is setting when starting or totally behind horizon?

however, now, moon is 'half full'. saved at radar contact to go to lunch. reloading game, it is still at 'half full. (why?) is math correct for hourly correction? I think this is still very usable for planning and thank you for bringing it up

thinking about it, I save often, so i'll go back to july 1 and see if it is a new moon.

Sean C · 06-25-17, 09:58 PM

Not sure if this helps, but in RL celnav the Sun and Moon are considered to be rising or setting when their "upper limb" (the top) is just on the horizon. This occurs when the bodies are actually 0°50' below the horizon. This is because atmospheric refraction* at the horizon amounts to about 34' and the semi-diameter (half of the diameter) is about 16'. Add those together and when the center of the body is calculated to be at an altitude of -0°50', the upper limb should just be touching the horizon.

*Refraction can be calculated using the formula -0.0167°/tan(H+7.32/(H+4.32)) ...where H = altitude in decimal degrees.

aanker · 06-27-17, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveR

so last night, got distracted by tv and was brought back to the game with a 'warship sighted'. there in the rising first-q moon was an escorted convoy; [on 12th patrol, July 2, 1943 ~22:00 and this is my first convoy, let alone an escorted convoy]. pissed off, decided this was a good spot to experiment.

so just reading off chart in notepad, I got the following: July 2, 1943 - new moon 12:44 ; July 10, 1943 - f-quarter 16:29. (

I figured this is saying, over the 8 days, the moon goes from new moon to f-quarter, starting at 12:44 and ending at 16:29. but then, the game only has four phases.)

then pulled out for july 2nd and 3rd:
2- mr: 05:00, ms: 19:03, sr: 05:02, ss: 19:05
3- mr: 05:49, ms: 19:49, sr: 05:03, ss: 19:05
(

oops, I was actually looking at "setting" f-quarter moon)

now the fun part: sub is approximately at 140.5w. add in the 7.5 offset, then (180-148 = 32 and divide by 15 = 2.133 or 2:08 hours. then added in offset hour(?), to get a 3:08 correction. which becomes -
2- mr: 0808, ms: 22:57, sr: 08:10, ss: 22:13

loaded game and sun is totally set by 22:43. moon will not be far behind.
So is sun/moon rise when it first peeks out or fully up? is setting when starting or totally behind horizon?

however, now, moon is 'half full'. saved at radar contact to go to lunch. reloading game, it is still at 'half full. (why?) is math correct for hourly correction? I think this is still very usable for planning and thank you for bringing it up

thinking about it, I save often, so i'll go back to july 1 and see if it is a new moon.

If you're at approx 140d, you are roughly -4 hours if Pearl is your home port. The clock in your boat is home port, Pearl base time and you need to calculate from Pearl 'base time'.

The 180d is not base time unless you're sailing out of Midway. In Pacflt I always sail out of Pearl.

Did I misunderstand your situation? What is your home port?

DaveR · 06-27-17, 05:01 PM

thx Nathaniel.

home port is midway.

thought of another way. once on station, measure sunrise/set time and calculate offset from that. will try that tonight.

DaveR · 07-12-17, 11:35 PM

tried several times; all with similar results. currently, being at truk; from midway, I came up with a 2:08 hour difference. date is 20Nov43. sun up is listed 6:27 and measured time was 7:08 or 0:41 difference. sun down is listed at 17:00 and measured time was 18:54 or 1:54 difference. so far, really confusing;

, why the differences?

so then checked when the moon rose and it peeked out at 02:30. the listing for moon rise/set is:
Nov19 23:35 12:23
Nov20 ' - ' 12:59
Nov21 00:28 13:33

For Nov20, if the ' - ' means zero, at least closer to the 2:08.

So what does the ' - ' mean? that measured moon rise was at 02:30 on 'Nov21'; but the chart list 00:28 for the 21st.

so far, all the moon phases' have been correct and all though I measured a lot of weird times: still find this all useful for planning.

06-13-17, 12:50 PM	#16
aanker Pacific Thunder Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Yellow Sea Posts: 1,896 Downloads: 236 Uploads: 14	I have modded my own game, fixing and fine tuning many things. The Spyron mod I like to use won't be compatible with FOTRS due to circumstances beyond my control. If you send me the F1 in-game Help file, it would be easy to add the three Tabs (pages) from greyrider's mod to it.... or you could easily add them yourself - it is a copy paste operation and renumbering the 'chapters' and paragraphs in them with find replace. Some of the SH4 Help file isn't helpful so I combined some of it and managed to free up 3 pages for the Celestial/Almanac data. That work wasn't necessary but I didn't want Tabs scrolling down the F1 page. Happy Hunting! __________________ " Bless those who serve beneath the deep, Through lonely hours their vigil keep. May peace their mission ever be, Protect each one we ask of thee. Bless those at home who wait and pray, For their return by night and day."

06-13-17, 06:00 PM	#19
propbeanie CTD - it's not just a job Join Date: May 2016 Location: One hour from Music City USA! Posts: 10,098 Downloads: 451 Uploads: 2	I'm trying to get his fingers screwed down to the table, but he keeps squirming away... I haven't gotten into the Help portion yet to see what he did to that, but if aanker doesn't have the time, I'll be trying it, and will see how different FotRSU is from TMO / RSRDC for that portion. That'll be the hard part. The drawing lines is just tedious - unless those can go in the menu_1024_768.ini also, then they become difficult... __________________ "...and bollocks to the naysayers" - Jimbuna

06-13-17, 07:55 PM	#21
propbeanie CTD - it's not just a job Join Date: May 2016 Location: One hour from Music City USA! Posts: 10,098 Downloads: 451 Uploads: 2	I can either open my Google Drive for an upload, or I'll take a link from you, and do the editing, unless you want to dig into that part of it. PM my PM and they'll do lunch... Unfortunately, keltos01 and I filled up my DropBox, and I can't figure out how to get space back... some of this new-fangled computer stuff does me in... __________________ "...and bollocks to the naysayers" - Jimbuna

06-24-17, 04:19 PM	#22
DaveR A-ganger Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 72 Downloads: 190 Uploads: 0	finally I missed this moon/sun rise/set from sh1; find this more of a tactical decision making item, than how long the stupid ship sinks. where are these charts? thanks (mod? : [need a smiley looking at watch])

06-24-17, 04:28 PM	#23
propbeanie CTD - it's not just a job Join Date: May 2016 Location: One hour from Music City USA! Posts: 10,098 Downloads: 451 Uploads: 2	They're not directly in the game... That's what we're working on, is a substitute for it for a few mods... It will still involve the user having to do some math __________________ "...and bollocks to the naysayers" - Jimbuna

06-24-17, 04:34 PM	#24
DaveR A-ganger Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 72 Downloads: 190 Uploads: 0	check (was looking for and found greywolves download)

06-25-17, 05:49 PM	#26
DaveR A-ganger Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 72 Downloads: 190 Uploads: 0	so last night, got distracted by tv and was brought back to the game with a 'warship sighted'. there in the rising first-q moon was an escorted convoy; [on 12th patrol, July 2, 1943 ~22:00 and this is my first convoy, let alone an escorted convoy]. pissed off, decided this was a good spot to experiment. so just reading off chart in notepad, I got the following: July 2, 1943 - new moon 12:44 ; July 10, 1943 - f-quarter 16:29. (I figured this is saying, over the 8 days, the moon goes from new moon to f-quarter, starting at 12:44 and ending at 16:29. but then, the game only has four phases.) then pulled out for july 2nd and 3rd: 2- mr: 05:00, ms: 19:03, sr: 05:02, ss: 19:05 3- mr: 05:49, ms: 19:49, sr: 05:03, ss: 19:05 ( oops, I was actually looking at "setting" f-quarter moon) now the fun part: sub is approximately at 140.5w. add in the 7.5 offset, then (180-148 = 32 and divide by 15 = 2.133 or 2:08 hours. then added in offset hour(?), to get a 3:08 correction. which becomes - 2- mr: 0808, ms: 22:57, sr: 08:10, ss: 22:13 loaded game and sun is totally set by 22:43. moon will not be far behind. So is sun/moon rise when it first peeks out or fully up? is setting when starting or totally behind horizon? however, now, moon is 'half full'. saved at radar contact to go to lunch. reloading game, it is still at 'half full. (why?) is math correct for hourly correction? I think this is still very usable for planning and thank you for bringing it up thinking about it, I save often, so i'll go back to july 1 and see if it is a new moon.

06-25-17, 09:58 PM	#27
Sean C Grey Wolf Join Date: Jun 2017 Location: Norfolk, VA Posts: 984 Downloads: 16 Uploads: 2	Not sure if this helps, but in RL celnav the Sun and Moon are considered to be rising or setting when their "upper limb" (the top) is just on the horizon. This occurs when the bodies are actually 0°50' below the horizon. This is because atmospheric refraction* at the horizon amounts to about 34' and the semi-diameter (half of the diameter) is about 16'. Add those together and when the center of the body is calculated to be at an altitude of -0°50', the upper limb should just be touching the horizon. Refraction can be calculated using the formula -0.0167°/tan(H+7.32/(H+4.32))* ...where H = altitude in decimal degrees.

06-27-17, 05:01 PM	#29
DaveR A-ganger Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 72 Downloads: 190 Uploads: 0	thx Nathaniel. home port is midway. thought of another way. once on station, measure sunrise/set time and calculate offset from that. will try that tonight.

07-12-17, 11:35 PM	#30
DaveR A-ganger Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 72 Downloads: 190 Uploads: 0	test tried several times; all with similar results. currently, being at truk; from midway, I came up with a 2:08 hour difference. date is 20Nov43. sun up is listed 6:27 and measured time was 7:08 or 0:41 difference. sun down is listed at 17:00 and measured time was 18:54 or 1:54 difference. so far, really confusing; , why the differences? so then checked when the moon rose and it peeked out at 02:30. the listing for moon rise/set is: Nov19 23:35 12:23 Nov20 ' - ' 12:59 Nov21 00:28 13:33 For Nov20, if the ' - ' means zero, at least closer to the 2:08. So what does the ' - ' mean? that measured moon rise was at 02:30 on 'Nov21'; but the chart list 00:28 for the 21st. so far, all the moon phases' have been correct and all though I measured a lot of weird times: still find this all useful for planning.