M1 Tank Platoon II

[Polak2]

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[Polak2]

One thing which is for sure superior in 3Dfx is smoke or to be more general - transparency and semitransparency rendering.

About being more proficient in M1TP2 it is my opinion that the maps are too small and they do not allow for more efficient maneuvering of the friendly units around OPFOR. A 2x size map would be IMHO better and I was hoping to try to mod that.

[RetroGamer]

Originally Posted by Polak2

One thing which is for sure superior in 3Dfx is smoke or to be more general - transparency and semitransparency rendering.

About being more proficient in M1TP2 it is my opinion that the maps are too small and they do not allow for more efficient maneuvering of the friendly units around OPFOR. A 2x size map would be IMHO better and I was hoping to try to mod that.

If you can mod the map, that’s impressive!

A few other observations about realism - which is kind of a ridiculous subject…

There should be a way to designate sectors of fire. I recall at the Infantry Officer Basic Course (IOBC) back in the ‘80s, there was in-depth discussion about everyone engaging the same target, blowing it to hell, only to have an unobserved enemy element fire upon your unit, while you’re distracted over killing the 1st target.

On Bradley Table XII, which is the platoon level qualification at Fort Hood, we would be “gigged” or docked points if somebody fired on a target outside of his sector of fire. That was a major part of our eval, come to think of it.

I noticed in M1TP2, sometimes somebody would fire upon my target right as I’m about to engage. True, I was Bradley Mech, not Armor, but the principle is the same.

Also, something that I find humorous- tanks running into each other! Lol!!! Maybe that happens in war (I never saw any action in theatre so I do not know), but in training, that’s also MAJOR and requires an investigation if it happens. I think everyone involved in the collision is mandated to report to the medics and I’d have to do an accident report. Anyway, that’s going on all the time in M1TP2 as you all know.

One final laugh - Bradley IFVs traveling cross country with the TOW launchers up. That’s another big no-no…my gunner relayed to me that can seriously damage the launcher or at least it’s calibration.

I admit it’s kind of fun knowing a little bit about this subject and observing the game companies’ sometimes inaccurate take on things.

Here’s another one that keeps popping in my head - “Always scan in low mag, sir!” I was kind of admonished by my gunner in the COFT simulator for scanning for targets in High-mag. In M1TP2, I’m always scanning in low mag as a result….I can still hear the disgust in SSG Guzman’s voice, lol!

I guess I’m on a roll - the OP Order…wow, what they’re depicting in the game is far from what we were taught. It should be one sentence that relays, “we are successful when ___ happens”. It’s ok. I don’t really like 100% realism.

[Polak2]

I admit it’s kind of fun knowing a little bit about this subject and observing the game companies’ sometimes inaccurate take on things.

this is the "cherry on the cake" in this thread.

Always scan in the low mag, sir!

a good one and in a way very intuitive, as one can cover much more of the surroundings and do it faster.

Bradley IFVs traveling cross country with the TOW launchers up]...[ can seriously damage the launcher or at least it’s calibration

nice detail to know.

Tanks running into each other

that maybe could be cured.

There should be a way to designate sectors of fire.

we need to dig into mission editing.. its all a text file, but some are not.

Just wish more people expressed interest in this old great tank simulation.

[Polak2]

Question: are the tanks in the platoon marked in any way to differentiate the Platoon Leader, Platoon Sgt and both wingmen?

[RetroGamer]

Originally Posted by Polak2

Question: are the tanks in the platoon marked in any way to differentiate the Platoon Leader, Platoon Sgt and both wingmen?

There were no obvious markings other than stenciled vehicle numbers that you could only see close up.

Each Bradley CFV and IFV had a number stenciled on the back. We were working with M1 tank platoons, and as I recall the tanks and every vehicle had a marking denoting it’s specific unit but there was nothing other than that.

Mine, for example, was HQ #301 if I remember correctly. The scout platoon was technically part of the headquarters company even though we reported directly to the battalion commander.

The vehicle designations described in the M1TP2 manual appear accurate and were similar to how our vehicles were marked. FM 17-98 was my main guide book back in the day. I studied it religiously in the fall and winter of 1990!

There’s a flaw in the logic of the scout platoon mission in that “what can be seen can be hit, what can be hit can be killed” - our mission was to gain and maintain contact with the enemy - apparently without being seen….in a two story tall screaming M3 CFV!

We carried twice the ammo as a standard M2 IFV, but we were not to engage.

Upon studying tactics, I came to the conclusion the scouts mission is basically to get out in front of the battalion and if we get destroyed, the main force knows where the enemy is! The awfulness of that was discussed in the first M1 Tank Platoon manual!! Sending vehicles out to see what shoots at them. That was an effective tactic in the first game even though it was frowned upon.

I came to the conclusion we should’ve been on motorcycles or something quiet and camo’d up. You can’t sneak around in an M3 Bradley CFV. You will be seen - and hit. I would’ve preferred a hummer with the windshield down and top off but even that’s a bit loud.


More trivia - around that time, there were only two PC games depicting platoon level armored combat. M1 Tank Platoon (the best) and Armored Fist 1994 (the most fun for me). Ed Dille wrote the Armored Fist Strategy Guide which was fun reading. I also noticed he is credited in the M1TP2 manual. His name also appears as a tank crewman on the platoon roster in the game!!

I enjoyed Armored Fist immensely because it was a civilian’s take on the subject. That game was just really interesting. They got some stuff right, some was total fantasy, probably because everything was classified then.

Fun memories…ancient history now.

[RetroGamer]

It’s been years but I recall some units did have their own markings on the rear of their vehicles. I believe that was a unit-specific SOP.

They consisted of symbols. Our unit had no such markings, however.

Oh, and full disclosure….I am by no means an expert in any of this stuff. I was a young lieutenant in the National Guard, put charge of a cavalry scout platoon in the fall of 1990. I was light infantry prior to that so I had to learn mech and armor specific tactics quick. By April of 1991 we had done about 6 months on active duty which included an NTC rotation. By May 1991 it was all over.

To be an effective leader, you must be able to function on very little sleep in uncomfortable weather conditions. You must be able to pay attention during briefings and pick out what’s specific to your platoon, then brief the PSG and section leaders.

It sucked, big time! I wasn’t always the greatest at it, either but I tried. You have to be patient when things break, too. CVC helmets, final drives, the main gun, radios…they all broke down which I did not have the patience for.

Yup - ancient history now. I still enjoy armor simulations on the PC because when you’re tired, you can quit and rest!!