Writing a novel on Imp. Kilos, need some sources

[CapitaCatalunya]

Hello guys,

I've been for some time now set on writing a novel centered on those sweet 636's, and although I collected a (for my humble standards) wealth of info, I'm still in need of help.

I'm looking basically for two things:

a "generic" crew manifest (well, at least a list that shows how the crew is organised in a Kilo), something similar to this:

http://www.russialink.org.uk/kursk/crew-eng.htm

And well, a floorplan, if they are available at all...I found very nice cutouts such as this one:

http://media.defenceindustrydaily.co...Cutaway_lg.jpg

but they don't really show much detail, or how is the kitchen (does it has a "downstairs" pantry like the Agosta class??), how many crew cabins, etc

I've been mostly relaying on some excellent video material such as the RT's "Baltic Fleet" (the sub is a 877 kilo, not the newer 636)

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...8OcjUpxkFGIDeg

And a couple of indian documentaries on the "Sindughosh class"





btw, those sindugosh look ancient

The indian docus show areas I am very interested into, like as i said the kitchen area, corridors, etc, but I need some more detailed layout.


After almost giving up I thought that if I needed something as specialised as this, I might as well ask the pro's , and when it gets to submarines it doesn't get better than Subsim.

If you would be kind enough to support this inexperienced Tom Clancy european wanabee I'll be infinitely grateful.

P.S: Any kind of material is welcomed, books (are there any novels set in a Kilo? would love to know, couldn't find any myself), films, anything really that shows the interior in any detail

[Onkel Neal]

Hey man, good luck with this project, I will enjoy reading it.

Have you read Patrick Robinson's Kilo Class ?

[Aktungbby]

CapitaCatalunya

[CapitaCatalunya]

Originally Posted by Onkel Neal

Hey man, good luck with this project, I will enjoy reading it.

Have you read Patrick Robinson's Kilo Class ?

Thank you Onkel, will definitely check that one, it seems it is a sequel of "Nimitz class" which has good reviews

Just to give you a snippet of what mine's about, it deals with submarine and surface warfare in the Western Mediterranean in the very near future

[Kapitan]

i can tell you everything is on one level in a Kilo yes they do have spaces under the floor the batteries are in the front and rear of the submarine under the floor and can be accessed by panels in the floor, whats more the pantry is on the same level as the galley.
You will find cut away's and drawings hard to find these submarines are still active and still being built and the older ones differ from the new ones in some cases considerable especially export models.

[Kapitan]

This is the best one ive found so far problem is its of an 877 not a 636 layout is similar but there are differences

[Aktungbby]

httphttp://defense-update.com/20120817_improved_kilo.html

[Kapitan]

can see the differences ive been digging out my books they have no plans in them sadly only information.

[Aktungbby]

Originally Posted by Kapitan

can see the differences ive been digging out my books they have no plans in them sadly only information.

Indeed. very few diagrams but since they're still upgrading for export market, probably still under tight key.

"In 2008 Vietnam signed a US$2 billion deal to buy the six Project 636M Kilo class submarines from Russia. All subs are scheduled for delivery by 2016"

At least they'll be allied to the US for suppressing the current Chinese island expansion in the 'cow's lick' http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/russia/636m.htm https://news.usni.org/2012/08/20/russian-subs-vietnam

[CapitaCatalunya]

Please allow me to resurrect this thread with an update on my part. As I've said, I've been "writing" (more like documenting myself) a war/political thriller novel based on modern submarines for the past two years.



I havent have much time to dedicate to it, had to take looooong brakes and got more systematic on my approach, I've been building my fictitional fleet from scratch, and currently I'm trying to choose the best submarines for it. I've shortlisted the Japanese Soryu class, the Dolphin-II and yes, the 636.1 Kilos (believe it or not acquiring each of these types makes sense in-universe). I would really, really love to consider the Akula-III's, they are my favourite SSN's (although the Astutes are growing on me) but the conflict I'm portrying takes place in the Mediterranean littoral areas,and nuclear subs are at a significant disadvantage there. My navy will be figthing against a NATO-style navy equipped with Scorpene-style subs (AIPs).


I've been "asking around" trying to get more info on the newest Kilos (636.1) but although I learned a lot, such as that they have the pantry besides the Kitchen, not on a lower level like the french subs do (I love this aspect of french subs) there's still so much I don't know.


For example, do the 636's crew have to manually check the acid-lead batteries as they do in the 877's (at least the Indian and Iranian Kilos do it that way) crawling on those sliding thinggies??



Do the Kilos have a watermaker? The indian sailors I watched said they don't wash ever during missions and the shower had a lock


Do the 636 Kilos have a mess for the crew, or they eat on their cabins as in the 877's? I know the Lada does, and it's not bigger than the Kilo and in a russian 636 documentary I saw they showed a mock mess room in the shipyard where they built the subs, but I don't speak russian and the auto translated captions are horrible


Thank you thank you thank you in advance

[Kapitan]

Originally Posted by CapitaCatalunya

For example, do the 636's crew have to manually check the acid-lead batteries as they do in the 877's (at least the Indian and Iranian Kilos do it that way) crawling on those sliding thinggies??

Yes they do all submarines including nuclear ones who have lead acid batteries do this too.



Do the Kilos have a watermaker? The indian sailors I watched said they don't wash ever during missions and the shower had a lock

The indians run older type kilos they use absorbent overalls the new 636.1 does have a limited osmosis plant


Do the 636 Kilos have a mess for the crew, or they eat on their cabins as in the 877's? I know the Lada does, and it's not bigger than the Kilo and in a russian 636 documentary I saw they showed a mock mess room in the shipyard where they built the subs, but I don't speak russian and the auto translated captions are horrible

The have a small mess area so i am told, there has been a redesign of the 636.1 and more modern modular sections put in the systems are also more updated there is a roomer they may start trialing towed sonar array.


Thank you thank you thank you in advance

please see answers in red

[CapitaCatalunya]

Originally Posted by Kapitan

please see answers in red

Thanks a lot, Kapitan , I really apreciate this information, I loved the modular mess room and the fact they still have to check the batteries with those sliders give me lots of possibilities


Maybe you've already seen it but I've found a recent (2017) russian documentary on the 636.3's Kilos, it is in 1080p and it shows quite detailed views of the interior (minor, I think, the sonar room), it's also quite long, almost an hour.



here it is:





I really wish there was something like this https://haynes.com/en-gb/astute-clas...bmarine-manual for the modern Kilos


Do you mind if I ask you how they depoly special forces underwater? do they use the Torpedo tubes? I saw that the Akula-III's had some exercices like that to evacuate the crew in case of disaster.



Also do every crewman has a bunk or there's hot bunking as usual. I calculated they would need around six crew cabins for full accomodation but again, pure speculation on my part.

[Kapitan]

Originally Posted by CapitaCatalunya

Thanks a lot, Kapitan , I really apreciate this information, I loved the modular mess room and the fact they still have to check the batteries with those sliders give me lots of possibilities

Same on any submarine that carries lead acid batteries even the nuclear boats go through the same process

Maybe you've already seen it but I've found a recent (2017) russian documentary on the 636.3's Kilos, it is in 1080p and it shows quite detailed views of the interior (minor, I think, the sonar room), it's also quite long, almost an hour.

I haven't seen it but will watch it the newest submarines do feature much upgraded sonar systems and waterfall displays the 636.3 has been around and even now being tweaked.



here it is:





I really wish there was something like this https://haynes.com/en-gb/astute-clas...bmarine-manual for the modern Kilos

Pinch of salt though so dont rely on it and whats more Russia is still very closed when it comes to the military


Do you mind if I ask you how they depoly special forces underwater? do they use the Torpedo tubes? I saw that the Akula-III's had some exercices like that to evacuate the crew in case of disaster.

Deploying Spec Ops i wouldn't know i am afraid i would assume they use a lock out chamber, however i doubt they would use a kilo not when they just commissioned the special projects submarine (now the largest submarine in the world) Belogorad (Former project 949A) and also the converted KS64 Moscow an ex Delta IV SSBN


Also do every crewman has a bunk or there's hot bunking as usual. I calculated they would need around six crew cabins for full accomodation but again, pure speculation on my part.

I am aware with numbers on the Russian boats being as low as 45 every man has a bunk depending of course the mission

This is a documentary of the Baltic fleet the submarine Magnitogorsk is featured you get a good look inside her

[Red_88]

Here is one Episode from the full version of the series posted by kapitan.



At this Episode beginning at 16:50 there are some good views on the kilo's sonar station. Keep in mind this is a Project 877 kilo though.
Also it seems they have a sonar display repeater in the control room. There is a very short glimpse on the repeater at 9:59. While the view on the station is not bad it is hard to understand for me how the sonar display works, anybody have an idea?
Also at 9:59 where you can see the repeater on its left is an interesting console with an display. It doesn't look like a radar screen, any ideas?