My Theory

Méo · 02-01-10, 08:54 PM

I've already made a post about it but I thought it could fit better for a whole thread.

I've seen so many comments comparing SHV with simulations like Aces of the deep that I came to wonder why those types of simulations are no longer in development? (except for independent development with very limited budget).

So my ''theory'' (this is only a ''theory'', I don't claim to have a certainty on these things)
is that the gaming market is largely influenced by our modern way of life.

i.e. Today everything has to be quick. Quick dinner, quick training, quick entertaining... and so on.

So deep simulations with an important learning curve are no longer attractive (except for a minority, in which I am included).

I think Ubisoft understood that and this is what Dan meant when he said in the interview (the video interview) that you don't have to read 10 books on German U-boat to play the game.

I'm afraid we will have to rely on the modding community in the future to get those games a much more deeper content.

mookiemookie · 02-01-10, 09:00 PM

I think you're exactly right. The younger generation has been so bombarded with stimuli that anything requiring a modicum of patience is not appreciated. A subsim is by very definition an exercise in patience and hunting....not a big seller in today's go go now now now world.

I replayed Call of Duty: World At War the other week (there's another thing...it took me 3 days to beat the whole SP game)...and the cutscenes in the game...super slick and well done with the animation, but they just flew by. Any visual element of them wasn't on the screen for more than 1 to 2 seconds. The kids of today wouldn't demand anything different.

Another indicator....check out a blockbuster movie trailer made in the past 5 years. Compare it to one made 30 or 40 years ago. Today's movie trailers are a barrage of images and scenes. Rapid fire eye movement...constant stimulation.

For better or for worse, this is how our entertainment is being fed to us now.

Iron Budokan · 02-01-10, 09:04 PM

I expect both of you are correct. Societal interests are always changing, and we are going to have to rely on modders to provide deeper, more meaningful, content.

conus00 · 02-01-10, 09:04 PM

I think you both nailed it.
Kids don't even read books nowadays.

Highbury · 02-01-10, 09:08 PM

I think the game companies want it this way. They want ADD kiddies that always need a new game every two weeks. It costs them less to produce such crap and they make more then they do off of people who are content with a good title for 3 - 5 years.

Méo · 02-01-10, 09:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mookiemookie

The younger generation has been so bombarded with stimuli that anything requiring a modicum of patience is not appreciated

Exactly!

I have no idea what will be the solution...it's like trying to solve the insoluble.

Modding will always have limits I guess.

artao · 02-01-10, 09:13 PM

... IMHO the 'solution' is companies that actually care about gaming, and not just profits ... how, who, and when are yet to be seen tho ...

Méo · 02-01-10, 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Highbury

I think the game companies want it this way. They want ADD kiddies that always need a new game every two weeks. It costs them less to produce such crap and they make more then they do off of people who are content with a good title for 3 - 5 years.

Yeah! another good point.

KL-alfman · 02-01-10, 09:19 PM

cut the pocket-money!!

Méo · 02-01-10, 09:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by artao

... IMHO the 'solution' is companies that actually care about gaming, and not just profits

I don't think a company really cares... it's always come down to people in that company, good people cares.

Good, passionate & competent people backed with a good budget can do miracles, IMHO.

tomoose · 02-01-10, 09:24 PM

Yup, it's all about "attention span", LOL. I forget where I saw/heard this but as a graphic example look at any modern music video such as seen on MTV (MTV is hard to watch on any given day anyway!

). Not one camera angle/view will last more than 5 seconds before it changes. I've actually tried this and it's accurate. Each time the camera view changes in the video start counting, you'll rarely reach 5 seconds. That about sums up the "younger generation" and the quick fix/disposable society we live in (and is probably a clear sign I'm getting older, LOL).

Iron Budokan · 02-01-10, 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by conus00

I think you both nailed it.
Kids don't even read books nowadays.

Reading has always been an eclectic activity. And you're right, kids don't read print books, but they do read e-books, more and more.

I expect the argument was much the same when the Gutenberg Press came into being. "These kids nowadays. Don't know the value of vellum!"

Captain Sub · 02-01-10, 09:36 PM

Quote:

Kids don't even read books nowadays.

Yea and I as a kid feel pretty damaged, as I have aquired this "faster, quicker, more exciting" mind over many years through this new age of hyper-entertainment. It's ruined my peace and patience and reading books really is harder for me now.

peace

theluckyone17 · 02-01-10, 10:17 PM

Could be Ubisoft and the Dev's are going by the assumption that the "short attention span" market is larger, and they can make more profit by orienting the game towards them.

However, they've still got the core followers in us old school simulator types. We're obviously devoted to the series. We're willing to spend the time modding the game into a simulator.

So if they market the game towards the "SAS" crowd, in addition to providing the tools to modify the game into a sim, then they've hit both markets with a minimum of effort (thereby maximizing profits).

Leo_93 · 02-01-10, 10:29 PM

I totally agree with you theluckyone17, its not like the SAS crowd will want to mod a Sim into a navel shoot em up game anyway right.

02-01-10, 08:54 PM	#1
Méo Ace of the Deep Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Quebec City Posts: 1,153 Downloads: 258 Uploads: 0	My Theory I've already made a post about it but I thought it could fit better for a whole thread. I've seen so many comments comparing SHV with simulations like Aces of the deep that I came to wonder why those types of simulations are no longer in development? (except for independent development with very limited budget). So my ''theory'' (this is only a ''theory'', I don't claim to have a certainty on these things) is that the gaming market is largely influenced by our modern way of life. i.e. Today everything has to be quick. Quick dinner, quick training, quick entertaining... and so on. So deep simulations with an important learning curve are no longer attractive (except for a minority, in which I am included). I think Ubisoft understood that and this is what Dan meant when he said in the interview (the video interview) that you don't have to read 10 books on German U-boat to play the game. I'm afraid we will have to rely on the modding community in the future to get those games a much more deeper content.

02-01-10, 09:00 PM	#2
mookiemookie Navy Seal Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 9,404 Downloads: 105 Uploads: 1	I think you're exactly right. The younger generation has been so bombarded with stimuli that anything requiring a modicum of patience is not appreciated. A subsim is by very definition an exercise in patience and hunting....not a big seller in today's go go now now now world. I replayed Call of Duty: World At War the other week (there's another thing...it took me 3 days to beat the whole SP game)...and the cutscenes in the game...super slick and well done with the animation, but they just flew by. Any visual element of them wasn't on the screen for more than 1 to 2 seconds. The kids of today wouldn't demand anything different. Another indicator....check out a blockbuster movie trailer made in the past 5 years. Compare it to one made 30 or 40 years ago. Today's movie trailers are a barrage of images and scenes. Rapid fire eye movement...constant stimulation. For better or for worse, this is how our entertainment is being fed to us now. __________________ They don’t think it be like it is, but it do. Want more U-boat Kaleun portraits for your SH3 Commander Profiles? Download the SH3 Commander Portrait Pack here.

02-01-10, 09:04 PM	#3
Iron Budokan Sea Lord Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Texas Posts: 1,778 Downloads: 32 Uploads: 0	I expect both of you are correct. Societal interests are always changing, and we are going to have to rely on modders to provide deeper, more meaningful, content. __________________ "You will take on England wherever you find her ships, and you will break her power at sea." --Iron Coffins, Herbert A. Werner http://kennethmarkhoover.com

02-01-10, 09:04 PM	#4
conus00 Grey Wolf Join Date: May 2008 Location: DB85 Posts: 804 Downloads: 166 Uploads: 0	I think you both nailed it. Kids don't even read books nowadays. __________________

02-01-10, 09:13 PM	#7
artao Officer Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 238 Downloads: 144 Uploads: 0	... IMHO the 'solution' is companies that actually care about gaming, and not just profits ... how, who, and when are yet to be seen tho ... __________________ l8r, artao

02-01-10, 09:08 PM	#5
Highbury The Old Man Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: 51.557, -0.102 Posts: 1,311 Downloads: 177 Uploads: 0	I think the game companies want it this way. They want ADD kiddies that always need a new game every two weeks. It costs them less to produce such crap and they make more then they do off of people who are content with a good title for 3 - 5 years.

02-01-10, 09:19 PM	#9
KL-alfman Grey Wolf Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Weimar Posts: 930 Downloads: 86 Uploads: 0	cut the pocket-money!! __________________ Life, Liberty and Property!

02-01-10, 09:24 PM	#11
tomoose Grey Wolf Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 930 Downloads: 23 Uploads: 0	Couldn't agree more. Yup, it's all about "attention span", LOL. I forget where I saw/heard this but as a graphic example look at any modern music video such as seen on MTV (MTV is hard to watch on any given day anyway!). Not one camera angle/view will last more than 5 seconds before it changes. I've actually tried this and it's accurate. Each time the camera view changes in the video start counting, you'll rarely reach 5 seconds. That about sums up the "younger generation" and the quick fix/disposable society we live in (and is probably a clear sign I'm getting older, LOL).

02-01-10, 10:17 PM	#14
theluckyone17 Captain Join Date: May 2006 Location: Niskayuna, NY Posts: 482 Downloads: 103 Uploads: 0	Could be Ubisoft and the Dev's are going by the assumption that the "short attention span" market is larger, and they can make more profit by orienting the game towards them. However, they've still got the core followers in us old school simulator types. We're obviously devoted to the series. We're willing to spend the time modding the game into a simulator. So if they market the game towards the "SAS" crowd, in addition to providing the tools to modify the game into a sim, then they've hit both markets with a minimum of effort (thereby maximizing profits).

02-01-10, 10:29 PM	#15
Leo_93 Aviator Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 59 Downloads: 134 Uploads: 0	I totally agree with you theluckyone17, its not like the SAS crowd will want to mod a Sim into a navel shoot em up game anyway right.