Im at a loss for words

[GoldenRivet]

INTRODUCTION TO THE GAME / TRAINING MISSION

Great introduction to the game.

however the "training mission" if that is what you dare call it is FAR too arcade like. i seriously felt like i was playing , only with ships.

let me summarize the opening scene

"Hey you.. wake up.. captain wants to see you on the bridge."

you go to the bridge

"well... looks like we are finally at war, oh well."

"SHIP SPOTTED! right there... holy sh*t i swear it is right there it just appeared out of nowhere... i could break wind on it from here it is so close!"

"Quick... get to the periscope and sink at least 2 of them"

done!

"congrats... you are now a U-boat commander W00+!"

the end

The game really needs a whole series of playable training missions.

the interface, options, crew interactions, skill sets etc are FAR too complicated for even the EXPERT SUBSIMMER to pickup quickly thus the need for about a dozen training missions.

because there is no printed manual, there is no ability to read the damned thing WHILE PLAYING as a reference. you have to write down any questions or curiosities you have then reference the included "manual" later on.

==========================================

CREW INTERACTION / RPG ELEMENTS

at first i thought "COOL!" i asked the 1WO about his family, and got a whole speech about his kids and wife etc. Awesome

I asked the radio guy about his brother aboard the bismark, the chief about his apparently ill wife and so on and so on.

about an hour later... about 2 hours later, about 3 hours later... NONE of these men's dialogue options ever changed. so... i have to ask... if it is always the same, whats the point.

the only unique thing i encountered during trying out dialogue was that EVENTUALLY the "pirate" started bitching aloud, in the middle of the command room about how the crew doesnt respect him and he wants me to do something about it.

ummmmm ok? i'll go have a talk with this dude about his wife... will that help?

As far as mission briefings... there is a naval officer who's sole job in life is to stand in the u-boat pen, next to your boat and wait for you to be ready for a mission. when you interact with him he tells you to "come in" and you fade out to a map screen.

=========================================

WATCH CREW

I order the crew to man the deck gun... i assume this would mean ATTACK A SHIP... but there is no obvious way to make them do this.

furthermore, once they are on the deck gun, there is no known way to get them off of it. they just stay put through the whole campaign if i dont submerge.

same goes for the flak gun.

The watch crew - dare i call them that - is a disgrace. They are blind, deaf, and apparently hallucinating.

The watch crew is on a continuous loop of pointing at random, non-existent objects that apparently only they can see in their hallucinogenic world.

however, i sailed to within 800 meters of a large british merchant ship... not one watch crew ever called it out or even hinted to the fact that we were about to collide with the enemy. they just sat there... in there LSD induced stupidity pointing at the invisible flying unicorn people.

======================================

ENEMY AI

on more than one occasion I closed to within pissing distance of a DD which was apparently either abandoned... or the entire crew was experimenting with the same hallucinogenic drugs that my crew was by now completely stoned out of their skulls with.

because the enemy DD didnt even turn its guns, maneuver, shake a fist... react AT ALL. For the love of God at least fart in my general direction!!!

=======================================

CREW CAPABILITY / SKILLS / SPECIAL POWERS WHATEVER

Im not sold on this crew ability thing... how do you use the abilities? when do you use them? why have them anyhow?

i received a contact report of a convoy (you dont so much receive them as they appear on the map so you have to watch for it) and set up and intercept.

told the torpedo man "Warm up the weapons"

"CANNOT COMPLY"

ummmmmm... ok? perhaps you didnt understand me... we are about to go shoot these torpedoes at the enemy stop standing there playing pocket pool and get the gadamned weapons ready.

same situation with the "sound guy" i select "Reveal hidden enemies" when trying to make sound contact with a convoy that must surely be nearby... "I CANT DO THIS RIGHT NOW"

Ummmmmm ok you want me to come back in 10 minutes? cause we can totally put the war on hold until you get your turds in a pile.

==================================

PLAYABILITY

If you have been following the silent hunter series from day one... prepare to get mind f*cked here... because everything you have known for the past 14 years is going to get turned on its head.

Interface, key strokes... the whole works... it has been completely - and i mean COMPLETELY overhauled... to the point that it is not even recognizable as a member of the silent hunter franchise.

the GUI leaves a LOT to be desired and provides the player with almost NO instantaneous access to important... nay... VITAL game information.

the "ahead slow" "ahead flank" "ahead standard" that is pretty much been the staple of the subsim franchise is GONE to be replaced with. "Extreme speed ahead"

wait?

extreme speed ahead?

he says... Extreme speed ahead.

ever heard that order given on a ship? I havn't... until now.

=======================================

THE GOOD STUFF

there are a few things i like in the game that i would have really loved to see expanded.

the role playing element... though new to a submarine simulation adds an interesting dynamic.

I understand that it would take 5 years to come up with enough dialogue for the characters to have something new to say every day or every few days... but we really need more than 5 weeks at sea asking "number two" about his family... or asking the radio guy about his brother.

=============================

SUMMARY

Silent hunter 5 was just released and is already standing at a fork in the road.

the road to the left... far less traveled...

the road to the right... trodden down... a beaten and familiar path to video games

If silent hunter 5 takes the road to the left - through heavy patching, mods etc (like always - thanks for nothing Ubi) it could go down in history as a trend setting masterpiece.

If SH5 takes the road to the right... it will fade into obscurity as a game that had a lot of neat concepts and ideas... but that ultimately failed.

[CCIP]

Great overview, I agree with much of what you've said. Ultimately, the clock is ticking on the developers to do something about the frustrating issues and turn this into what it should be.

[Capt.Warner]

I agree as well,this game isn't even nearly finished.

[Flopper]

Loss for words?

I've been sitting on the fence, and actually had started looking at machines today contemplating a purchase. After reading this, I think I'll relax for a while longer and see what develops, as the only reason I'd consider getting a new computer at this point would be for SH5.

Thanks a lot for the info. Loss for words, he says!

[Sunfighter]

Golden, about the crew abilities, They will say they wont/cant do them but they still do them anyways. At least my guys do. As long as you have those world of warcraft style buffs showing. The sonar guys skill is very uh..strong....especially if you have map updates enabled...you can basically track everything nearby for a VERY long time as if you had your scope up down to watching them manouver on the map.

[Agustus]

You pretty much nailed it, Golden. In fact, I think you were generous.

I'm almost beginning to wonder whether they deliberately released this early - WAY too early - in order to test the "always on" DRM before their golden child Prince of Persia was released with the same DRM.

Ubisoft used to be known for its quality games. What we're experiencing here is ridiculous.

[Herr Graf]

Great review and could not agree more.

[Gato76]

Don't forget the TDC,instead of dials now we have this links u suppose to click on then in the same order all over and over and over again,boring, btw where is the ship draft in the recognition manual ?

[GoldenRivet]

Speaking of recognition manual.

WHAT RECOGNITION MANUAL???

you have little pop ups that you scroll through.

doesnt even look like a book... no data on the ships, length, beam, draft, mast height.

NOTHING

[GoldenRivet]

I have to applaud the voice talent.

very nice job i think!

and to the dev team... programming this thing couldnt have been a simple task... even to get it to its current state.

i think you guys really needed about another year

[Gato76]

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

Speaking of recognition manual.

WHAT RECOGNITION MANUAL???

you have little pop ups that you scroll through.

doesnt even look like a book... no data on the ships, length, beam, draft, mast height.

NOTHING

How are we suppose to use the torpedo magnetic settings if there is no way to know the ship draft ? maybe we get it as an upgrade after 1943 this game is unfinish

[Steeltrap]

Golden, that was classic. Had me laughing at a few points.

Makes me feel like I'm not missing anything at all through maintaining my DRM stance.

Can't say I'm surprised, either. Companies push out all sorts of crap because they know the gameplaying public will purchase them like a bunch of Pavlovian crack addicts. SH is no exception. Hell, they even put a turd on the plate they served and called it OSP, and still people lap it up.

We deserve every dreadful, buggy, poorly thought out, shabbily coded and overpriced piece of sheisse we get because we continue to consume them every single time. It's like we're Charlie Brown and developers/publishers are Lucy.

"C'mon, THIS time you can kick a goal - we PROMISE we'll deliver the ball right where you want it"

Of course, poor old Charlie ends up on his arse every time.

*sigh*

Bring back MicroProse etc etc, the devs/publishers who couldn't rely on patches so had to release their games in a fit state, and when machines didn't have the god-like graphics of today that are used as a smokescreen to hide how poorly finished the games behind them are.

Rant over....

[Turbografx]

Originally Posted by Steeltrap

We deserve every dreadful, buggy, poorly thought out, shabbily coded and overpriced piece of sheisse we get because we continue to consume them every single time.

Bring back MicroProse etc etc, the devs/publishers who couldn't rely on patches so had to release their games in a fit state, and when machines didn't have the god-like graphics of today that are used as a smokescreen to hide how poorly finished the games behind them are.

Amen. I sure do miss me some of them who really cared about a quality product that THEY would be proud of and would play (SSI, Microprose, Dyanmix, Troika etc etc etc). Seems though that to stay in business you need to either:

A. Appeal to the common denominator.

B. Charge $60 plus for your product.

Of course today the trend is to combine both...

[Danevang]

Have you played after the patch?

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

INTRODUCTION TO THE GAME / TRAINING MISSION

Great introduction to the game.

however the "training mission" if that is what you dare call it is FAR too arcade like. i seriously felt like i was playing , only with ships.

let me summarize the opening scene

"Hey you.. wake up.. captain wants to see you on the bridge."

you go to the bridge

"well... looks like we are finally at war, oh well."

"SHIP SPOTTED! right there... holy sh*t i swear it is right there it just appeared out of nowhere... i could break wind on it from here it is so close!"

"Quick... get to the periscope and sink at least 2 of them"

done!

"congrats... you are now a U-boat commander W00+!"

the end

The game really needs a whole series of playable training missions.

the interface, options, crew interactions, skill sets etc are FAR too complicated for even the EXPERT SUBSIMMER to pickup quickly thus the need for about a dozen training missions.

because there is no printed manual, there is no ability to read the damned thing WHILE PLAYING as a reference. you have to write down any questions or curiosities you have then reference the included "manual" later on.

The training isn't very good, I agree, but to be fair, it never was in the previous games either.

CREW INTERACTION / RPG ELEMENTS

at first i thought "COOL!" i asked the 1WO about his family, and got a whole speech about his kids and wife etc. Awesome

I asked the radio guy about his brother aboard the bismark, the chief about his apparently ill wife and so on and so on.

about an hour later... about 2 hours later, about 3 hours later... NONE of these men's dialogue options ever changed. so... i have to ask... if it is always the same, whats the point.

the only unique thing i encountered during trying out dialogue was that EVENTUALLY the "pirate" started bitching aloud, in the middle of the command room about how the crew doesnt respect him and he wants me to do something about it.

ummmmm ok? i'll go have a talk with this dude about his wife... will that help?

As far as mission briefings... there is a naval officer who's sole job in life is to stand in the u-boat pen, next to your boat and wait for you to be ready for a mission. when you interact with him he tells you to "come in" and you fade out to a map screen.

The conversation needs more variety, I agree, but the eye patch guy complaining will lead to more conversation with other crewmates, you'll have decisions to answer various things to them etc.

The conversations you've already have just shouldn't be available again, that's all they should change.

The mission guy shows you which missions you can undertake now, at this time in the war, i.e. attack british coastal shipping, attack the blockade of Germany etc. I find it quite nice, compared to SH 3 & 4, you have much more control over which missions you get, and they actually have an impact on how the game proceeds.

WATCH CREW

I order the crew to man the deck gun... i assume this would mean ATTACK A SHIP... but there is no obvious way to make them do this.

furthermore, once they are on the deck gun, there is no known way to get them off of it. they just stay put through the whole campaign if i dont submerge.

same goes for the flak gun.

The watch crew - dare i call them that - is a disgrace. They are blind, deaf, and apparently hallucinating.

The watch crew is on a continuous loop of pointing at random, non-existent objects that apparently only they can see in their hallucinogenic world.

however, i sailed to within 800 meters of a large british merchant ship... not one watch crew ever called it out or even hinted to the fact that we were about to collide with the enemy. they just sat there... in there LSD induced stupidity pointing at the invisible flying unicorn people.

The watch crew constantly pointing annoys me too...but...how long have you been playing the game, and is it patched to 1.1.5, or whatever?

I get lots of contancts spotted, hydrophone contacts etc.

The deck gun works as in the other games, you make the crew man the gun, and select the target through your binoculars. I've had my guncrew destroy several merchants in this way. Also, some people have been complaining that there are no deckgun sights/binoculars. There's a button for that in the upper left corner.

ENEMY AI

on more than one occasion I closed to within pissing distance of a DD which was apparently either abandoned... or the entire crew was experimenting with the same hallucinogenic drugs that my crew was by now completely stoned out of their skulls with.

because the enemy DD didnt even turn its guns, maneuver, shake a fist... react AT ALL. For the love of God at least fart in my general direction!!!

I've been pinged, shot at and depthcharged by any DD I got within seeing/hearing/sonar range. Hell, I even got pounded by a huge British battleship north of Scapa Flow (I wanted to see how much damage I could do with the deckgun...not much, seems I was slightly out gunned) Is your game patched?

CREW CAPABILITY / SKILLS / SPECIAL POWERS WHATEVER

Im not sold on this crew ability thing... how do you use the abilities? when do you use them? why have them anyhow?

i received a contact report of a convoy (you dont so much receive them as they appear on the map so you have to watch for it) and set up and intercept.

told the torpedo man "Warm up the weapons"

"CANNOT COMPLY"

ummmmmm... ok? perhaps you didnt understand me... we are about to go shoot these torpedoes at the enemy stop standing there playing pocket pool and get the gadamned weapons ready.

same situation with the "sound guy" i select "Reveal hidden enemies" when trying to make sound contact with a convoy that must surely be nearby... "I CANT DO THIS RIGHT NOW"

Ummmmmm ok you want me to come back in 10 minutes? cause we can totally put the war on hold until you get your turds in a pile.

Yes, the morale system need some changing (abilities should not require at least one morale point). But the many options for upgrading your crew is very nice, in my oppinion. You can really customize your crew, getting a very fast boat, a very silent one, just an all round one, and so on.

PLAYABILITY

If you have been following the silent hunter series from day one... prepare to get mind f*cked here... because everything you have known for the past 14 years is going to get turned on its head.

Interface, key strokes... the whole works... it has been completely - and i mean COMPLETELY overhauled... to the point that it is not even recognizable as a member of the silent hunter franchise.

the GUI leaves a LOT to be desired and provides the player with almost NO instantaneous access to important... nay... VITAL game information.

the "ahead slow" "ahead flank" "ahead standard" that is pretty much been the staple of the subsim franchise is GONE to be replaced with. "Extreme speed ahead"

wait?

extreme speed ahead?

he says... Extreme speed ahead.

ever heard that order given on a ship? I havn't... until now.

I've been playing every game in the SH series, and I actually like many of the new features and changes. One just needs to play arround a bit, and learn it all...as with all new games. New features like the "Travel" mode, which doesn't stop time compression for anything, is nice. Now you can get through the Kiel canal in no time. Oh, and the Kiel canal is there, a plus too.

NO instantaneous access to important... nay... VITAL game information.

What info is that? I can get everything I need to know with a few clicks. Have you installed the Command Keys mod? It takes one sec, and enables the "Depth under keel" command (the only one that reeeally should have been in the game as released).

All in all I think that people should play the game some more, before complaining about the things that ARE in the game, but they just haven't figured out. (Deckgun i.e. which works as the in the other games)

The training mission has some features missing, not to confuse you I guess, but it only confuses you even more. As of your first mission, all features are there.

As far as I can tell, all the features of the old games are there, some of them have just been changed a bit, many for the better.

I've had some very interesting patrols already, and the game hasn't been out for very long, give it some time, play arround with the game mechanics, and I think (hope) that you will find many of the things you thought were gone, I know that I did. I have been a great fan of the SH series since the first one, was sceptical with regards to SH5, but can only say that I have been plesantly surprised. All one needs is an open mind, and a bit of patience (isn't this the model approach to all new simulators?)

PS: (F1 for help, which shows you the keyboard with all the buttons, and what they do. For example, hold Ctrl+ down, and you can finetune your speed, depth etc.)

[GREY WOLF 3]

What a great review, I'm glad i did not rush out and by it.
My grandchildren where going to buy me this in 2 weeks time,for my 60th birthday,Ive now got to be cruel and tell them not to wait to I'm 65 then it might be alright.

UBISOFT there will be 11 unhappy faces when i tell them this