Genuine Concerns About This Game

sergei · 03-03-10, 07:03 PM

Before I start this, it is not in the spirit of OMFG this game SUX LOL.

It is also not in the spirit of 'I can't believe you, you have a fully explorable U Boat interior, WTF is your problem'

I am hoping there are some of us who fall in the middle who want to make this game better, but are, frankly, disappointed with its current state.

MAJOR

1. Where the hell is my boat?
Sometimes I switch to external cam, and when I try to switch back, no matter how hard I try, I am still in external cam. A save and reload clears the problem, but really?

2. Tube Confusion
I have noticed a discrepancy between what my weapons officer says and the actual state of my tubes.
I loaded a save, for some reason you can see tubes 1 and 2 are open.

Now, I switched to tube 1, when I did that I was told 'closing tube 2', then I hit the key to open tube 1, and got the voice confirmation to that effect.
What do you suppose I saw?

this

OK that's a bit weird. I was told I was closing tube 2, and also that I had opened tube 1, but the opposite seems to be the case.
Also after I fired tube 1, then switched to tube 2, when I hit the button to open it, it would close, (confirmed by external cam, no screenshots available) and visa versa.
I believe this may be partial responsible for the misses to aft some people are seeing whilst trying to figure out the screwy TDC in this game

3. For the love of god dive
See an aircraft, hit crash dive, hit crash dive again, remain on the surface, the aircraft flies overhead. Nuff said.

4. I Thought Friends were electric?
Here is a pic of me attacking a tanker with 2 electric torpedoes.
See any problem with that?

5. At Least Try And get Away.
Sh3, a merchant notices you he will start a constant helm course around his base course, still very easy to intercept and torpedo.
SH4, some improvement,a merchant notices you he will try his best to get the hell away from where he last saw you.
SH5, a merchant notices you, I'm afraid it's back to SH3 type behavior.

6. I'm Not Telepathic
Ok, playing on manual targeting I expect not to be given target speed on the map. But, click on the target and it is display in the bottom right of the screen.
See this pic. I guess I'll have to turn map contacts off altogether, or be told the speed of the contact.

Yes I know I can just not click on the enemy ship. But it shouldn't be there though, should it?

7. They Can't All Be This Good.
I am playing with duds switched on. I have now fired somewhere in the region of 25 torpedoes, and have had no duds or prematures. Anyone else seen ANY duds?

8. UZO Bizzaro
When I first go to the UZO it looks like this

Then I zoom in using the mouse wheel, and it looks like this

It never lets me zoom back out to the first setting though.

9. For Gods Sake Number One, I Said 200 Meters
Go deep, say below 190 meters. Then Try and keep your depth steady.
Below about 190 meters it seems that you need about 5 knots to keep from sinking.
EDIT: I am not sure if this is a bug or a feature. I guess the forums will tell!

MINOR

1. I sank a Liberty freighter sailing towards Scotland in October '39. Admitedly this is probably because of the limited roster of ships for Britian. Still seems a bit weird though.

2. Extreme Speed Ahead?
I'm pretty sure there is not any navy in the world that does not call this Ahead Flank.

3. Reloaded a saved game and the ship sunk icons of the vessels I had attacked had disappeared. This was sometimes the same in 3 and 4 so I can let this one go.

4. Option checked for stabilized view. UZO is perfectly calm. Binocs are all over the place. This may be as designed.

5. U Boat changes depth WAY too quick. I'm not about to get into a statistical argument about it, but it is even quicker than a fleetboat in stock SH4, which can't be right, surely?

6. Very difficult to set accurate depth.
OK when on shallow depth meter, but try setting a depth of, for example, 195 meters on this control and see how you do

7. They don't all carry fireworks surely?

When I do enough damage to a ship the all look like this

And I mean, every one!

8. Loss of functionality in Map

By which I mean, if I plotted a search pattern in the other games, I could tell at a glance everything I needed to know about it.
eg. the length, and time of each leg, and the length a and time in total of the search pattern.

this is what I get now

As you can see, when I hover the mouse over a waypoint, in the bottom right it gives me the distance and time, to the nearest minute (nice), to that waypoint.
And I can do that to any waypoint I wish.
But I Miss seeing the whole thing at a glance.

I'm probably being a bit anal now.
Next I'll be complaining about rivets on the conning tower.

Onkel Neal · 03-03-10, 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sergei

Before I start this, it is not in the spirit of OMFG this game SUX LOL.

this

3. For the love of god dive
See an aircraft, hit crash dive, hit crash dive again, remain on the surface, the aircraft flies overhead. Nuff said.

.

If you, the captain, are on the bridge, you, the captain, have to move your butt down the hatch before the boat will dive. Practice your crash dive drills.

Paajtor · 03-03-10, 07:08 PM

Are Friends Electric is a great song, but that ^^ sucks (elec.torps).

sergei · 03-03-10, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neal Stevens

If you, the captain, are on the bridge, you, the captain, have to move your butt down the hatch before the boat will dive. Practice your crash dive drills.

Sorry I should have qualified that statement Neal.
Since I found out about that, I tend to have my character hang about down below.
That way, if I get an aircraft spotted I can crash dive straight away. And if I get get a ship spotted I run up the ladder to eyeball it.
Actually I quite like it like that.
Makes me feel like a real Captain.
'SHIP SPOTTED'. Runs up the ladder.
'"WO Where is the ship?"
"Dunno Captain, but my little Karrle is starting school next year"

I have on occasion been down below, had an aircraft spotted, hit crash dive, and had bugger all happen.

Only sometimes mind.

I'm not deliberately trying to find fault, just reporting stuff so we can make this better.
See this post.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sergei

I cannot defend the game.

Let me give you a little background on why I bought it, and why I am putting my time into trying to fix it, despite despite the fact that it is, quite frankly, a pretty poor show at the moment.

I only got into PC gaming, oh jeez, I guess about 2 years ago.
Before that I was a console boy.
I didn't want to be, most console games are not really my thing. I just couldn't afford a PC.
Anyway, about 2 years ago I was finally in a position to finally afford a PC.
Bought it specifically to play SH4. (Silent Service 2 on the AMIGA had made a deep impression!)

By the time got here, the game was almost fully patched (1.4), and there was a lovely selection of great mods to chose from.
In fact, when I look at the games I have played since I got a PC, IL2, Rome and Med Total War, SH3, SH4, Oblivion, it's the same story every time. Someone else had done the hard work for me.
When I look at the forums on these games I see a lot of anger and frustration around about the release date. Eventually these games have been well patched up. Furthermore, there has followed a multitude of fantastic mods for all of these games.

I have been lucky enough to come to these games when they have been fully patched (NOT resolving all issues, I know that), and well modded up.

I never had to do my time in the trenches for any of these games.
I understand many people buying SH5 being pissed off. I agree, it does not seem to be a properly finished game.
Hopefully one day SH5 + Mods of choice will be a superb combination.
It may not happen, but I am hoping it will.

So I will take my turn in the vanguard, as part of the forlorn hope.

Maybe 2 years down the line someone a little bit like me, who has never played a Subsim before, will stumble across SH5 + whatever we have managed to make and enjoy it.

killpo1 · 03-03-10, 08:34 PM

I can confirm duds, I've had around 2 so far, and also one premature explosion, and 1 motor failure, even though I've fired alot more than 25 torpedo so far so the percentages are prob. off.

sergei · 03-03-10, 08:51 PM

OK, that's good. At least they are there.

ETR3(SS) · 03-03-10, 08:51 PM

Two things. First about the tubes being screwy. Mind you I do not have a copy of the game. In "nautical land" even is port and odd is starboard. Maybe this got goofed this time? Or maybe there is conflicting ID numbers for the tubes themselves. Second the maintaining of 5kts to stay level. This sounds like the exact same problem that was present in 3 and 4. So hearing that I'm not holding out much hope for the fact that the boat will handle like a real submarine does.

Excellent and informative post though.

sergei · 03-03-10, 09:19 PM

I reloaded a save, stopped the boat, and went to the external cam.

First time, I selected tube 1 and hit open tubes button, the voice told me flooding tube 1. Went to external cam, and confirmed tube 1 was open.
Cycled to tube 2.Tube 1 now closed. Hit button to open selected tube (tube2). Voice told me flooding tube 2. Confirmed by external cam.

This is as it should be.

It is more like SH3 than SH4.
Anyone with experience of both will remember that in Stock SH3 you can only have ONE tube open at a time. eg, you open tube 1. As soon as you select tube 2, tube 1 closes. (I think some mods changed this)
In SH4 I am pretty sure you can open as many as you like.
Seems to be more like SH3 at the moment.

IN THIS GAME:
As soon as I switch from tube 1 to tube 2, the voice tells me 'Closing tube 1
OK Fine.
But something got screwed up on the way. I think it may be because I opened tube 1, switched to tube 2 to change the pistol, (got the voice warning closing tube 1), the switched back to tube 1 again.

Now I am on tube 1 OK (you with me?)
When I hit the button to open the tube it closes it. I confirmed this with the external cam.
No screenshots to confirm, sorry.
I hit the button to close the tube (voice confirmation, closing tube 1), external cam shows the tube opening.

I switch to tube 2. Voice confirmation says closing tube 1. External cam shows Tube 1 open and tube 2 closed.

Switching to tube 2 opens tube 1 and closes tube 2.

I wonder if maybe this is responsible for at least some of the problems people are having aiming torpedoes in this game.

ETR3(SS) · 03-03-10, 09:22 PM

I see what you are saying now. The commands are getting reversed so to speak.

sergei · 03-03-10, 09:56 PM

Yeah, it only seems to happen every now and again.

Like my mission voices bug (not mentioned in original thread!)

It seems to be an intermittent thing.

etheberge · 03-03-10, 11:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sergei

2. Extreme Speed Ahead?
I'm pretty sure there is not any navy in the world that does not call this Ahead Flank.

First of all amazing post Sergei, truly.

Second every time I see and hear "Extreme Speed Ahead" I'm reminded of this :

sergei · 03-03-10, 11:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by etheberge

First of all amazing post Sergei, truly.

Second every time I see and hear "Extreme Speed Ahead" I'm reminded of this :

Would you believe I've never seen that before?
Prepare the ship for - Ludicrous Speed!

etheberge · 03-03-10, 11:58 PM

plus our boat accelerates so fast that it might as well be going to Ludicrous Speed

Turbografx · 03-04-10, 12:24 AM

It is probably a result of the translation of a phrase that was wrong to begin with. In fact, you're not far off with your comparison.

In the German speech they say "Wahnsinnige fahrt voraus" which means "crazy/senseless/mad speed ahead", actually it pretty much does mean "ludicrous speed ahead!"

The German navy did not use that as far as I know. Rather the command would be "Aüßerste fahrt" or " N x Aüßerste fahrt"

sergei · 03-04-10, 12:30 AM

[QUOTE=Turbografx;1291872"Wahnsinnige fahrt voraus"[/QUOTE]

Ah I remember that from SH3 (as I am sure others here do!)
Thank you for the clarification Turbografx.
I guess it is one of those things that does not translate well.

03-03-10, 07:03 PM	#1
sergei Sea Lord Join Date: May 2008 Location: London UK Posts: 1,788 Downloads: 405 Uploads: 29	Genuine Concerns About This Game Before I start this, it is not in the spirit of OMFG this game SUX LOL. It is also not in the spirit of 'I can't believe you, you have a fully explorable U Boat interior, WTF is your problem' I am hoping there are some of us who fall in the middle who want to make this game better, but are, frankly, disappointed with its current state. MAJOR 1. Where the hell is my boat? Sometimes I switch to external cam, and when I try to switch back, no matter how hard I try, I am still in external cam. A save and reload clears the problem, but really? 2. Tube Confusion I have noticed a discrepancy between what my weapons officer says and the actual state of my tubes. I loaded a save, for some reason you can see tubes 1 and 2 are open. Now, I switched to tube 1, when I did that I was told 'closing tube 2', then I hit the key to open tube 1, and got the voice confirmation to that effect. What do you suppose I saw? this OK that's a bit weird. I was told I was closing tube 2, and also that I had opened tube 1, but the opposite seems to be the case. Also after I fired tube 1, then switched to tube 2, when I hit the button to open it, it would close, (confirmed by external cam, no screenshots available) and visa versa. I believe this may be partial responsible for the misses to aft some people are seeing whilst trying to figure out the screwy TDC in this game 3. For the love of god dive See an aircraft, hit crash dive, hit crash dive again, remain on the surface, the aircraft flies overhead. Nuff said. 4. I Thought Friends were electric? Here is a pic of me attacking a tanker with 2 electric torpedoes. See any problem with that? 5. At Least Try And get Away. Sh3, a merchant notices you he will start a constant helm course around his base course, still very easy to intercept and torpedo. SH4, some improvement,a merchant notices you he will try his best to get the hell away from where he last saw you. SH5, a merchant notices you, I'm afraid it's back to SH3 type behavior. 6. I'm Not Telepathic Ok, playing on manual targeting I expect not to be given target speed on the map. But, click on the target and it is display in the bottom right of the screen. See this pic. I guess I'll have to turn map contacts off altogether, or be told the speed of the contact. Yes I know I can just not click on the enemy ship. But it shouldn't be there though, should it? 7. They Can't All Be This Good. I am playing with duds switched on. I have now fired somewhere in the region of 25 torpedoes, and have had no duds or prematures. Anyone else seen ANY duds? 8. UZO Bizzaro When I first go to the UZO it looks like this Then I zoom in using the mouse wheel, and it looks like this It never lets me zoom back out to the first setting though. 9. For Gods Sake Number One, I Said 200 Meters Go deep, say below 190 meters. Then Try and keep your depth steady. Below about 190 meters it seems that you need about 5 knots to keep from sinking. EDIT: I am not sure if this is a bug or a feature. I guess the forums will tell! MINOR 1. I sank a Liberty freighter sailing towards Scotland in October '39. Admitedly this is probably because of the limited roster of ships for Britian. Still seems a bit weird though. 2. Extreme Speed Ahead? I'm pretty sure there is not any navy in the world that does not call this Ahead Flank. 3. Reloaded a saved game and the ship sunk icons of the vessels I had attacked had disappeared. This was sometimes the same in 3 and 4 so I can let this one go. 4. Option checked for stabilized view. UZO is perfectly calm. Binocs are all over the place. This may be as designed. 5. U Boat changes depth WAY too quick. I'm not about to get into a statistical argument about it, but it is even quicker than a fleetboat in stock SH4, which can't be right, surely? 6. Very difficult to set accurate depth. OK when on shallow depth meter, but try setting a depth of, for example, 195 meters on this control and see how you do 7. They don't all carry fireworks surely? When I do enough damage to a ship the all look like this And I mean, every one! 8. Loss of functionality in Map By which I mean, if I plotted a search pattern in the other games, I could tell at a glance everything I needed to know about it. eg. the length, and time of each leg, and the length a and time in total of the search pattern. this is what I get now As you can see, when I hover the mouse over a waypoint, in the bottom right it gives me the distance and time, to the nearest minute (nice), to that waypoint. And I can do that to any waypoint I wish. But I Miss seeing the whole thing at a glance. I'm probably being a bit anal now. Next I'll be complaining about rivets on the conning tower.

03-03-10, 07:08 PM	#3
Paajtor The Old Man Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: The Dutch mountains Posts: 1,551 Downloads: 64 Uploads: 1	Are Friends Electric is a great song, but that ^^ sucks (elec.torps). __________________

03-03-10, 08:51 PM	#7
ETR3(SS) Ocean Warrior Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Between test depth and periscope depth Posts: 3,021 Downloads: 175 Uploads: 16	Two things. First about the tubes being screwy. Mind you I do not have a copy of the game. In "nautical land" even is port and odd is starboard. Maybe this got goofed this time? Or maybe there is conflicting ID numbers for the tubes themselves. Second the maintaining of 5kts to stay level. This sounds like the exact same problem that was present in 3 and 4. So hearing that I'm not holding out much hope for the fact that the boat will handle like a real submarine does. Excellent and informative post though. __________________ USS Kentucky SSBN 737 (G) Comms Div 2003-2006 Qualified 19 November 03 Yes I was really on a submarine.

03-03-10, 09:22 PM	#9
ETR3(SS) Ocean Warrior Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Between test depth and periscope depth Posts: 3,021 Downloads: 175 Uploads: 16	I see what you are saying now. The commands are getting reversed so to speak. __________________ USS Kentucky SSBN 737 (G) Comms Div 2003-2006 Qualified 19 November 03 Yes I was really on a submarine.

03-03-10, 11:58 PM	#13
etheberge Watch Officer Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Montreal, QC Posts: 345 Downloads: 614 Uploads: 10	plus our boat accelerates so fast that it might as well be going to Ludicrous Speed __________________ 11 War Patrols / 56 ships sunk or damaged for 212,022 tons Zero casualties throughout the war Scuttled on 8 May, 1945 in Sonderburg Bay, after German surrender

03-03-10, 08:34 PM	#5
killpo1 Watch Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 16 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	I can confirm duds, I've had around 2 so far, and also one premature explosion, and 1 motor failure, even though I've fired alot more than 25 torpedo so far so the percentages are prob. off.

03-03-10, 09:19 PM	#8
sergei Sea Lord Join Date: May 2008 Location: London UK Posts: 1,788 Downloads: 405 Uploads: 29	I reloaded a save, stopped the boat, and went to the external cam. First time, I selected tube 1 and hit open tubes button, the voice told me flooding tube 1. Went to external cam, and confirmed tube 1 was open. Cycled to tube 2.Tube 1 now closed. Hit button to open selected tube (tube2). Voice told me flooding tube 2. Confirmed by external cam. This is as it should be. It is more like SH3 than SH4. Anyone with experience of both will remember that in Stock SH3 you can only have ONE tube open at a time. eg, you open tube 1. As soon as you select tube 2, tube 1 closes. (I think some mods changed this) In SH4 I am pretty sure you can open as many as you like. Seems to be more like SH3 at the moment. IN THIS GAME: As soon as I switch from tube 1 to tube 2, the voice tells me 'Closing tube 1 OK Fine. But something got screwed up on the way. I think it may be because I opened tube 1, switched to tube 2 to change the pistol, (got the voice warning closing tube 1), the switched back to tube 1 again. Now I am on tube 1 OK (you with me?) When I hit the button to open the tube it closes it. I confirmed this with the external cam. No screenshots to confirm, sorry. I hit the button to close the tube (voice confirmation, closing tube 1), external cam shows the tube opening. I switch to tube 2. Voice confirmation says closing tube 1. External cam shows Tube 1 open and tube 2 closed. Switching to tube 2 opens tube 1 and closes tube 2. I wonder if maybe this is responsible for at least some of the problems people are having aiming torpedoes in this game.

03-03-10, 09:56 PM	#10
sergei Sea Lord Join Date: May 2008 Location: London UK Posts: 1,788 Downloads: 405 Uploads: 29	Yeah, it only seems to happen every now and again. Like my mission voices bug (not mentioned in original thread!) It seems to be an intermittent thing.

03-04-10, 12:24 AM	#14
Turbografx Old Stormalong Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: The Gret Stet of Loosiana Posts: 232 Downloads: 104 Uploads: 0	It is probably a result of the translation of a phrase that was wrong to begin with. In fact, you're not far off with your comparison. In the German speech they say "Wahnsinnige fahrt voraus" which means "crazy/senseless/mad speed ahead", actually it pretty much does mean "ludicrous speed ahead!" The German navy did not use that as far as I know. Rather the command would be "Aüßerste fahrt" or " N x Aüßerste fahrt"

03-04-10, 12:30 AM	#15
sergei Sea Lord Join Date: May 2008 Location: London UK Posts: 1,788 Downloads: 405 Uploads: 29	[QUOTE=Turbografx;1291872"Wahnsinnige fahrt voraus"[/QUOTE] Ah I remember that from SH3 (as I am sure others here do!) Thank you for the clarification Turbografx. I guess it is one of those things that does not translate well.