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Catfish · 09-20-21, 02:34 PM

Europe is no unified "state", it is 27 sovereign countries.
If some of those act in Africa, or the middle East, or near China the uproar is big, "how can/should/dare they?!"
On the other hand the same people demand that Europe grows together and takes its future into its own hands.
At the same time denying Europe an own army able to achieve interests.
But saying 24/7 that Europe should have one.
Complaining against everything with the wind changes is not productive.
How about making up your mind? There is no goal or target that can be achieved if Europe goes on like before in this deteriorating transatlantic relationship.

Sykybird can make fun all he wants about lacking the will and tenacity, there are enough people who will do this job, just not possible in the ridiculous environment in which "allies" do not ask other "allies" acting alone without any information beforehand; and then some oh so special ally pretend you can have your cake and eat it. I am still astonished that the UK does not realize how it has been snubbed by the US but hey, special reationship. Keep on dreaming.

re Aukus, papers called a contract about a submarine deal have been signed between Australia and France.
"contract, signed in 2016 with French company DCNS (now known as Naval Group) to build 12 Barracuda submarines for Australia"
What does anyone think what happened in those five years? Does anyone think France gets the money and time back, are those boats in production? What happens to them?

09-20-21, 02:34 PM	#57
Catfish Dipped Squirrel Operative Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: ..where the ocean meets the sky Posts: 16,897 Downloads: 38 Uploads: 0	Europe is no unified "state", it is 27 sovereign countries. If some of those act in Africa, or the middle East, or near China the uproar is big, "how can/should/dare they?!" On the other hand the same people demand that Europe grows together and takes its future into its own hands. At the same time denying Europe an own army able to achieve interests. But saying 24/7 that Europe should have one. Complaining against everything with the wind changes is not productive. How about making up your mind? There is no goal or target that can be achieved if Europe goes on like before in this deteriorating transatlantic relationship. Sykybird can make fun all he wants about lacking the will and tenacity, there are enough people who will do this job, just not possible in the ridiculous environment in which "allies" do not ask other "allies" acting alone without any information beforehand; and then some oh so special ally pretend you can have your cake and eat it. I am still astonished that the UK does not realize how it has been snubbed by the US but hey, special reationship. Keep on dreaming. re Aukus, papers called a contract about a submarine deal have been signed between Australia and France. "contract, signed in 2016 with French company DCNS (now known as Naval Group) to build 12 Barracuda submarines for Australia" What does anyone think what happened in those five years? Does anyone think France gets the money and time back, are those boats in production? What happens to them? __________________ >^..^<*)))>{ All generalizations are wrong.