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Skybird · 11-06-08, 02:06 PM

AntEater,

The Poles abuse the umbrella of their NATO membership for trying to straighten some bills with the Russians, by provoking them where they can and pokingthem in their backs with a pencil. That is not what NATO is there for. Warzaw finally should get a clear Western bashing for not stopping to do so childishly and narrow-minded.

Those people who now feel provoked by Russian missiles in the Kaliningrad enclave now experience how it feels from the Russian side with the Western plans for that missile system in Poland and the Czech republik. And the russians wanted to acchieve that effect, else they would not have chosen that isolated enclave, but some territory attached to the Russian mainland. It is an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth. and once again: they have said they would react to the american plans, sooner or later. we would do the same, if we were in their place.

This does not mean that their demand to be seen as a global power on same eye level with the US isn't a bit exaggerated. The west heavily depends on Russia, for cooperation in the UN (Iran, etc), and energy. but the russians do not have the ability to actively manouver around all the globe and project military power at will like america can. However, just ignoring them and dealing with them as haughty and arrogant as over the past 15 years, does not work, for that they are too strong a regional power on quite a bit of the planet's surface. Leave them in their sphere of influence and avoid useless provokations over nothing but the question who has the longer one. Accepting them to play their opera costs us nothing, but eventually earns us their good will in cooperation in international issues (of which their are so damn many that the West alone cannot solve them), so smile and clap your hands and accept to spend some flattery on them. that they cannot or do not wish to contribute to those mentioned internantional issues does not mean that we necessarily can have progress in these fields against them. Regarding the Kaukasus, that's their playground, not Washingtons, like Kanada or Mexico is not the Russian's playground, so leave them alone there. And Saakashvilistan - is not worth to mess up our relations with Russia for it, the government there is autocratic, supressive, it lied, betrayed and commited the same warcrimes it accused the russians of, so to hell with it. Regarding Ukraine, we should try to influence both sides to not using military force over their differences, but we should not allow the Ukraine into NATO. Beyond that, we should leave the issues to the two of them. Poland and the Baltic, despite all the hysteria by some, in no way I can see to be at risk.

11-06-08, 02:06 PM	#56
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,717 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	AntEater, The Poles abuse the umbrella of their NATO membership for trying to straighten some bills with the Russians, by provoking them where they can and pokingthem in their backs with a pencil. That is not what NATO is there for. Warzaw finally should get a clear Western bashing for not stopping to do so childishly and narrow-minded. Those people who now feel provoked by Russian missiles in the Kaliningrad enclave now experience how it feels from the Russian side with the Western plans for that missile system in Poland and the Czech republik. And the russians wanted to acchieve that effect, else they would not have chosen that isolated enclave, but some territory attached to the Russian mainland. It is an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth. and once again: they have said they would react to the american plans, sooner or later. we would do the same, if we were in their place. This does not mean that their demand to be seen as a global power on same eye level with the US isn't a bit exaggerated. The west heavily depends on Russia, for cooperation in the UN (Iran, etc), and energy. but the russians do not have the ability to actively manouver around all the globe and project military power at will like america can. However, just ignoring them and dealing with them as haughty and arrogant as over the past 15 years, does not work, for that they are too strong a regional power on quite a bit of the planet's surface. Leave them in their sphere of influence and avoid useless provokations over nothing but the question who has the longer one. Accepting them to play their opera costs us nothing, but eventually earns us their good will in cooperation in international issues (of which their are so damn many that the West alone cannot solve them), so smile and clap your hands and accept to spend some flattery on them. that they cannot or do not wish to contribute to those mentioned internantional issues does not mean that we necessarily can have progress in these fields against them. Regarding the Kaukasus, that's their playground, not Washingtons, like Kanada or Mexico is not the Russian's playground, so leave them alone there. And Saakashvilistan - is not worth to mess up our relations with Russia for it, the government there is autocratic, supressive, it lied, betrayed and commited the same warcrimes it accused the russians of, so to hell with it. Regarding Ukraine, we should try to influence both sides to not using military force over their differences, but we should not allow the Ukraine into NATO. Beyond that, we should leave the issues to the two of them. Poland and the Baltic, despite all the hysteria by some, in no way I can see to be at risk. __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert. Last edited by Skybird; 11-06-08 at 02:09 PM.