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Originally Posted by gumbeau
I've actually done all the trigonometry for shooting without range to target. Its pretty simple.
Get in a spot about 1000 yards from the predicted track of the target perpendicular to him and wait.
Plot his speed as best you can because his speed is the one important factor.
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Please don't read this wrong Gumbeau, but you are misleading her a bit. And if she doesn't understand the concept then you may totally confuse her. And Elphaba, please don't think I am calling you stupid either, I don't know how much you understand, I have never met you.
Gumbeau, you make the comment that you don't need to know "range to target" and then proceed to tell her to get about 1000 yards from the predicted course. Well, then you now know the approximate "range to target" because you just set it at 1000 yards. Now I totally agree you don't need to know EXACT range to target.
My example, if you are shooting at a merchant ship travelling slow at about 5-7 knots (I picked one from the manual, one of average length about 80m which is about 96 yards.) I don't know where you are from but I use yds not meters etc, but the idea is the same. If you have a torpedo that goes at 46knots (This is where Rockin's comment on torp speed comes in to play) that torp will go about 1500 yards in one minute. (Just quick off the cuff calculation, correct me if I'm wrong) The ship will take approximately 1 minute to go by, and you are 1000 yard away, so in this case if you fire when the bow is at 0 degrees, you are going to hit it because the ship takes one minute to go by but the torp doesn't take one minute to get there. You only need to lead it to spread the shots along the length. But if your torp is slower, like an electric, it won't get there in time, or if the ship is travelling a lot faster 10-12 knots, it won't get there in time because depending on the length of the ship, it will go by in 45 sec and your torp will go 1100 yards if it's a fast one (electrics go slower but I forgot how much and some torps like Rockin says have more than one speed). So even though Gumbeau is giving you good info, other factors come in to play. But I absolutely agree ship speed is very important.
If that ship turns and is 2000 yards away, it all goes out the window.
So I just wanted to add this to show that with experience and an approximate "range to target" it is possible to shoot from the hip. But Range, torp speed, ship speed, AOB all come into play. He has eliminated the range by telling you to get approximately 1000 yds away. He has eliminated AOB by having you place you sub at a 90 degree angle, and if you always use the same speed torpedo that variable is eliminated so that only leaves you to consider ship speed. So he is right, but in real life it is a bit more complicated, he is just trying to make it easier by using experience to position yourself to eliminate most of the variables and use your head to get good shots instead of taking a bad position and try to figure all the variables.
So, I agree with what you say, but feel she needs to understand why it works, because if the ship is zig-zagging or changes direction and by doing that changes "Range" then it will make a difference.
I can't comment on the Dick O'Kane method because I don't know what it is, but you can bet I'm going there right now to find out.
Peabody