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01-01-08, 10:32 PM

Now that you are going into more detail it helps. Not that I agree with everything you say, but hey, one thing U-boat men have to learn is getting along with others inside the steel tube. I think of all the military forces of modern civilization, its the navy that was the most humane. Partly because the main enemy of the navies is a shared one: the sea. And partly because navy men see the world, visit strange ports and distant lands. It opens minds. In WWII Germany it was really only the navy that did not fully suck down the Nazi logic.

Why don't you guys move this debate to the general section forum. Further flesh out your ideas and views there and I will keep an open mind. God knows if someone took a snap shot of me during my 20s, 30s, 40, and so forth, you'd have several different people at odds with one another.

Yes, usually small boys have to be trained to kill, just like lion cubs. Most primitive warrior societies started training them early so that by the time they were men they could slaughter without a second thought. Basically I see you are likely a humanist or socialist who views all difficult men as simply broken and in need of repair. And I would not disagree with all that. I believe that men are rarely individuals - and are almost always under contrl of some society, government, civilization or religion. Truth is we are down loaded with huge scripts and logic codes by the civilization that is over us, even from the time we sucked our thumbs - before we knew our right hand from our left hand. SO I do not lay the blame of ancient warriorism on individuals. Like I always say - IF a person is not a broken in the brain, generally he will be an ok guy on a one to one level no matter where he comes from. Its only when people are in groups, societies, clans, tribes, nations, civilizations that pack mentality takes over. Just like dogs - one dog rarely rips a small child apart. One dog is usually easy to get along with. But add more - until you have 3 to 5 and suddenly a new beast appears: the pack, and the pack has a super-mind of its own. Take an inner city gang member out of the city to a ranch or wilderness setting and within days his hard exterior begins to fall away.

Really when I was speaking about war and its history I was speaking about the super-minds (a kind of group-think meme) that takes over individuals and many of which go back into the most ancient of history. But, on the other hand, the Eskimos - living in the constant battle with nature (very harsh in the far north) tended to be very peace loving people - where even common anger was viewed as insanity.

Really I got into this debate on the tail end - and believe mere semantics was causing me to misunderstand you.

Be seeing you.

01-01-08, 10:32 PM	#220
Wave Skipper Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	Well Letum I think I had you wrong Now that you are going into more detail it helps. Not that I agree with everything you say, but hey, one thing U-boat men have to learn is getting along with others inside the steel tube. I think of all the military forces of modern civilization, its the navy that was the most humane. Partly because the main enemy of the navies is a shared one: the sea. And partly because navy men see the world, visit strange ports and distant lands. It opens minds. In WWII Germany it was really only the navy that did not fully suck down the Nazi logic. Why don't you guys move this debate to the general section forum. Further flesh out your ideas and views there and I will keep an open mind. God knows if someone took a snap shot of me during my 20s, 30s, 40, and so forth, you'd have several different people at odds with one another. Yes, usually small boys have to be trained to kill, just like lion cubs. Most primitive warrior societies started training them early so that by the time they were men they could slaughter without a second thought. Basically I see you are likely a humanist or socialist who views all difficult men as simply broken and in need of repair. And I would not disagree with all that. I believe that men are rarely individuals - and are almost always under contrl of some society, government, civilization or religion. Truth is we are down loaded with huge scripts and logic codes by the civilization that is over us, even from the time we sucked our thumbs - before we knew our right hand from our left hand. SO I do not lay the blame of ancient warriorism on individuals. Like I always say - IF a person is not a broken in the brain, generally he will be an ok guy on a one to one level no matter where he comes from. Its only when people are in groups, societies, clans, tribes, nations, civilizations that pack mentality takes over. Just like dogs - one dog rarely rips a small child apart. One dog is usually easy to get along with. But add more - until you have 3 to 5 and suddenly a new beast appears: the pack, and the pack has a super-mind of its own. Take an inner city gang member out of the city to a ranch or wilderness setting and within days his hard exterior begins to fall away. Really when I was speaking about war and its history I was speaking about the super-minds (a kind of group-think meme) that takes over individuals and many of which go back into the most ancient of history. But, on the other hand, the Eskimos - living in the constant battle with nature (very harsh in the far north) tended to be very peace loving people - where even common anger was viewed as insanity. Really I got into this debate on the tail end - and believe mere semantics was causing me to misunderstand you. Be seeing you.