Originally Posted by Skybird

You guys knowing whom I see as some kind of an idol, for myself, not having a better word for it? You would be surprised: Hagen of Tronje.

Now, this is a tragic dark figure. in the Nibelungen saga, he is the close advisor, personal friend and army leader of the Franconian king, Gunther, like his whole family has served for generations to the royal family. when Siegfried showed up in the saga, he stole a lot of fame and reputation from the Franconian king (although not aiming for it, or being aware of it), and all shine of what Hagen believed in was in danger to dissappear. So he decided to kill Siegfried, and Gunther and his brothers agreed, so that the Franconian kingdom may regain triumph in the name of it's own greatness, not Siegfrieds naive and uncaring acts that illustrated that he was more lucky than being a ripe, responsible character. for me, siegfried was an powerful but stupoid idiot who could not value what he had been given, and took it for granted instead. Life was easy on him, and served him on a silver plate what others had to work bitterly hard for. Hagen also knew that for this service history would recall him as the evil villain.

Later, Siegfried's wife Kriemhild (king Gunther's sister) swore revenge. she married king Attila, and followed him to his far away kingdom. From there, she decided to take revenge on her Royal family, and to see them getting wiped out to the last man for allowing her husband getting murdered for the fame of the Franconian kingdom. She sent a message that she is forgiving them, and invited them to a family celebration.

Again, Hagen proved his unshaken loyalty to the (weak) king, warning him that it is a trap and if they would go to Attila'S castle, it would mean their ultimate fall, and death for all. when Gunther and his brothers decided to accept the invitation, Hagen wass left free to choose wether he goes with them, or not, and although he knew that Kriemhild was very much aware that he was the one assassinating her husband, he called all the army to arms, and choosed to follow his king, loyal in the face of clear knowledge that they all would find their death at Attila'S castle.

when they arrived, Attila and Gunther, both not wishing to wage war against each other, tried to remain in control, but events unfolded that resulted in Hagen rejecting to disarmr his army (leaving them unprotected to the lust to murder of Kriemhild), and killing Attilas son instead, which led to open war between the heavily armed Nibelungen army (the Franconians, named after the Nibelungen treasure that Siegfried had found and given to Gunther, after Hagen killed Siegfried he sank all the gold in the Rhine, cursing it for having brought all that pity and fading of glory over the Franconians), and the lightly armed, but numercially superior army of the Huns. The battle unfolding was terrible, and the Franconians waded in blood like butchers, killing twenty huns for each of their own men falling. the castle goes up in flames, and several attempts to negotiate surrender got refused by the Franconians. In the end, only Gunther and Hagen were left, with the castle in ruins, and the Huns having suffered terrible losses - too much as if they could call it a victory. Hagen, now in chains, finally was confronted by Kriemhild showing him the head of her brother, king Gunther, who was executed on her command. when Hagen refused in disgust to tell her where he hid the treasure of siegfried, she killed him as well. A former friend of Hagen, living at attila'S castle since years, saw this courageous, loyal man and his king, Gunther, being murdered by this icy cold fanatical beast of a woman, and was so outraged that he drew his sword and slaughtered her as well. This was the end of the Nibelungen.

As you see, i have a very different view of Hagen than what most sources and versions of the saga describe him as. Usually he is described as the evil villain, the saga's pendant to Darth Vader. but whatever he did - he did it with determination, but also with a greater goal on mind: not to allow the one quality he believed in to be betrayed: the shine and glory of the franconian kingdom, which in the saga functions as a place of light, justice, and peace. He accepts to ruin his and his family's reputation, and takes the burden to become a murderer, in defense of this what he had identified to be the centre of light, so to speak. He also had an almost Prussian sense of serving, and loyalty. and he did not give up on these even in the face of doom, trying to defend his king against all odds, and although his king made a terrible mistake when accepting that lethal invitation.

That's why I have sympathy for Hagen. I do not see him as a completely dark figure. He is a tragic hero with whom history (the history of the saga) dealt with in a most unjust way to express some qualities of values that else would have remained in the hidden.

Please do not compare all this to what the Nazis made of it when talking of "Nibelungen-Treue". they gave the story, and so many others as well, a very serious twist, to abuse it for their own evil purpsoes. You all know it, and I know it too. No need to discuss this.

The Nibelungen-Lied is embedded in a circle of several other sagas as well, and together with the saga around king arthur, and some ancient Greek sagas, it is the greatest stuff of this kind that I know.