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Originally Posted by Rockin Robbins
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Originally Posted by Dude
Such places like the ones you described, with huge openings,deep with anchored ships are not called harbors.
They are called anchorages(rada as we called them here in Greece).
Piraeus is a port (the biggest port in Greece).The huge area outside south east of the port where large vessels go and stay in anchor, is called anchorage (rada).
Harbor raid you would have if the Jap subs/midgets have succeeded in entering the Pearl Harbor. In that sense it is more common to have harbor raids in Europe/Atlantic where you have more traditional ports/harbors.
This also why you had antisubmarine nets.In a harbor you have a narrow entry,thus you can build an antisubmarine net to protect your vessels inside.
In an anchorage,inside a huge bay, with an opening into the ocean of 12miles and a depth of 100meters of more, you can not have antisubmarine nets,you can not protect and control it.
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You're still ignoring Gene Fluckey's raid that garnered him the medal of honor. The words never and only are completely exclusive and unless you can explain away Fluckey's well-documented raid you cannot say American subs raided only "anchorages" however they are defined. And in the face of that, all definitions of "anchorage" are irrelevant distractions not contributing to resolution of the issue at hand. After all, if we treated Gunther Prein (stupid American keyboard!  ) that way, the U-Boats never raided any harbors. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. Let's play on a level field here.
Do we agree to have one discard for each argument, picked by the opposing side?  |
I have never said that nobody did it.All I tried to do was explain the technical difference between harbor and anchorage and why IMOHO it is easier to attack vessels in anchorage and more difficult inside a port.
I do not know American history since I am not an American so I can not comment about this captain's achievements.
I just believe it is easier to have harbor raids in European-English ports in Atlantic (not that it really happened apart from Scapa Flow) than in Japan-Pacific fleet.