SUBSIM Radio Room Forums - View Single Post - WW2 Sub sim game vs. RL U-boat captain

Platapus · 12-09-16, 08:34 AM

One of my peeves I like to pet concerning Submarine games is that we are often faced with two unrealistic options

1. The computer handles all the work with unrealistic accuracy.

2. The Captain (player) is the only one on the submarine and has to do everything manually.

Either one of these kills the simulation aspect of the game for me.

in real life, there was a highly trained crew, trapped in a sensory deprivation tube called the submarine. The crew was restricted to a few venues of data. Periscope observations and the various sound stations and later radar.

Any errors in any of these data sources, would be faithfully and accurately processed by the crew. If the Captain reports that the AOB is Port 35, that's what the crew will work with and generate a very precise report based on that data. If, however the actual AOB was Port 30.. oops

Not the crew's (computer's) fault.

What I would like to see in a submarine simulator is programming that allows the simulated crew to quickly and accurately process only the data that the player supplies. Any error in my observations would be considered "truth" by the crew/computer.

Since data comes in from diverse sources e.g., periscope, passive sound, active sound, radar and it is impractical that the player can man all the stations, there has to be some "Simulation of error" for the stations not being manned by the player.

These simulated errors would include

1. Errors in the equipment - Early radar might not have been as good as later radar
2. Errors in human observation. The equipment is showing accurate data but the simulated human is making a mistake. E.g., the sound is actually coming from 235 but is reported by the simulated human as 230

This places the player in a position of making a choice, which is the whole idea of such simulators. "Where do I go?"

Do I man the periscope and accept simulated errors in sound? or for this attack, is it better to man the hydrophone and accept periscope observation errors?

Classic command problem : Do I want to trust in my errors or someone else?

The player should not, unless specific options are selected, to be able to easily do all as a real life captain could not do all during an attack.

That, in my opinion, is what I would like to see in a new sub simulator.

Avoiding the unrealistic extremes (or more accurately giving the player the options) and requiring the player to act more in line with the limitations of a "real" captain.

No computer simulation can simulate the reality, but I feel we can go a lot further and get a little bit closer to certain aspects of reality.

However, it sometimes seems like most of the effort is being placed on graphics, which if you think about it is probably the least realistic aspect of being in a submarine.

Just my thoughts

12-09-16, 08:34 AM	#9
Platapus Fleet Admiral Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 19,388 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 0	One of my peeves I like to pet concerning Submarine games is that we are often faced with two unrealistic options 1. The computer handles all the work with unrealistic accuracy. 2. The Captain (player) is the only one on the submarine and has to do everything manually. Either one of these kills the simulation aspect of the game for me. in real life, there was a highly trained crew, trapped in a sensory deprivation tube called the submarine. The crew was restricted to a few venues of data. Periscope observations and the various sound stations and later radar. Any errors in any of these data sources, would be faithfully and accurately processed by the crew. If the Captain reports that the AOB is Port 35, that's what the crew will work with and generate a very precise report based on that data. If, however the actual AOB was Port 30.. oops Not the crew's (computer's) fault. What I would like to see in a submarine simulator is programming that allows the simulated crew to quickly and accurately process only the data that the player supplies. Any error in my observations would be considered "truth" by the crew/computer. Since data comes in from diverse sources e.g., periscope, passive sound, active sound, radar and it is impractical that the player can man all the stations, there has to be some "Simulation of error" for the stations not being manned by the player. These simulated errors would include 1. Errors in the equipment - Early radar might not have been as good as later radar 2. Errors in human observation. The equipment is showing accurate data but the simulated human is making a mistake. E.g., the sound is actually coming from 235 but is reported by the simulated human as 230 This places the player in a position of making a choice, which is the whole idea of such simulators. "Where do I go?" Do I man the periscope and accept simulated errors in sound? or for this attack, is it better to man the hydrophone and accept periscope observation errors? Classic command problem : Do I want to trust in my errors or someone else? The player should not, unless specific options are selected, to be able to easily do all as a real life captain could not do all during an attack. That, in my opinion, is what I would like to see in a new sub simulator. Avoiding the unrealistic extremes (or more accurately giving the player the options) and requiring the player to act more in line with the limitations of a "real" captain. No computer simulation can simulate the reality, but I feel we can go a lot further and get a little bit closer to certain aspects of reality. However, it sometimes seems like most of the effort is being placed on graphics, which if you think about it is probably the least realistic aspect of being in a submarine. Just my thoughts __________________ abusus non tollit usum - A right should NOT be withheld from people on the basis that some tend to abuse that right.