[Oberon]

Originally Posted by August

Here's some more food for thought though. Who appointed you our official decider of what needs "looking at"? Shall we start pointing out everything we think that you British should be looking at in every thread?

Give it a rest Oberon. We Americans have been closely looking at that very question since we decided not to be members of your empire anymore. You know this yet you continue to act like the next time you post your "friendly" reminder that we're going to suddenly smack ourselves on the head and say "Well shucks Papa English, we hadn't even given that a thought!". It's getting irritating and that's why I'm starting to doubt your true motivations.

We have a right to keep and bear arms. Period. end of story. Why we gave ourselves this right is NOT limited to, or restricted by, any single reason. None of our other rights are so limited nor are our rights limited to those listed in the Bill of Rights. Please learn to accept that.

It's funny, I could have sworn this was an international forum. Is it suddenly decided that discussion of America by non-Americans is forbidden?
I don't recall that Americans were hestitant to volunteer their opinion when the hostage taking crisis occured in Sydney recently.

Originally Posted by MH

A Strange post.
Your post somewhat reads in my head that the government and media are too powerful , the people too easy to manipulate therefore there is no point in 2 amendment any more.

It's not so much that there is no point, it's that perhaps a re-evaluation of what the Second Amendment is for is required, it has been 223 years after all. It's not as if new Amendments haven't been made to the US constitution over the past 223 years in order to change to fit the times. After all, the 18th Amendment was repealed, and other Amendments added to clarify and focus certain parts of US law which have changed since 1791.
I believe various court hearings have been heard in regards to the purposes of the 2nd Amendment, the most recent being the District of Columbia v. Heller, which concluded that the right to bear arms is not limited to being part of an organised militia, which is fair enough to be honest because that part of the 2nd Amendment is somewhat outdated and probably in need of review. Perhaps the 2nd Amendment should now just read:

The right of the People to keep and bear arms in the purpose of personal security, shall not be infringed.

That would be more accurate to the current situation to be honest, rather than the pre-amble about organised militia.

Of course, there's then the tricky situation of in a land where everyone has a gun what IS personal security? Whoever is fastest on the draw? If you see someone suspicious are you allowed to shoot them? What if someone else thinks that you're suspicious, even if you're not?

You can see how it's a tricky situation, and I don't envy Americans one bit for the headache it must cause to work it out, and the heartache it must cause the innocents who have been the victims of the mis-use of the 2nd Amendment, but equally I think it would be a mistake for Americans to think, as no doubt some of them will, that those countries in Europe with tighter gun controls are any less or, indeed, any more free than America is.

Still, this is Subsim, this is a gun control thread, it should probably be locked now before it goes downhill any further. GT cannot have a rational discussion about American politics, American gun control or Muslims, this is a fact of life.