SUBSIM Radio Room Forums - View Single Post - Work in Progress-Thermal layers...RELEASED

HEMISENT · 02-19-06, 02:38 PM

Guys, ever since the pinpoint drops thread of a couple months ago I've given a good bit of thought to realism for the sake of realism v. realistic behavior. We are never going to get absolute 100% realism the way this game is modelled. The best we can hope for is to modify, edit or tweak different settings in the attempt to give us all a somewhat more realistic, immersive behaviour based on but not limited to historical values. One of the areas that was the subject of a lot of back and forth discussion going back to SHII days was thermal layers.
I'm not getting into the part of whether or not they were charted, measured, able to be defined by the individual commander or even if they were an absolute ironclad way of escaping detection. The point I think we can all agree on is that they existed, they were located at different depths and the wise U Boat commander could use them to help get out of harms way if he was aware that his boat had entered into a thermal layer. At the end of the day they were a random element that could be useful in evading detection.

Thanks to Redwine's words of encouragement for sort of getting me back involved in this. Here's what I've been working on:
Right now using TT's mini tweaker I've edited the settings for all the active and passive sensor lines in the AI_Sensors.dat/Min Height =. By default these are all set at -300
For testing purposes I've set the active(sonar) at -200 and the passive(hydrophone) to -180. Testing this setting in the U 505 mission, once I've gotten the attention of the escorts I CD'd to 160m. The escorts were pinging like crazy making dc runs as normal. I crept down to 180m and noticed the green stealth meter begin to dirty up around 178 and go totally green in the low to mid 180's. If a DD began pinging the meter would instantly go red again.Creeping down to 200m with Escorts pinging the stealth meter again would dirty up just before 200 and continue to flicker until arounf 205m. The DD's continue to drop on the last, known position but eventually lose contact and disperse.After awhile knowing the pinging has ceased because the escorts are leaving I bring the boat back up. The meter stays green as I rise until I ordered ahead flank at around 190m and the meter again goes full red. Once I reduce speed the meter gradually goes back to green.
I've run this with both the U 505 mission + a DD test mission I made. results are identical.

Using the Random folder function in SH3 Commander I've now got a total of 20 random folders. I'm thinking I'll make 5 copies of the AI_Sensors .dat file. Each copy will have the Min Height= settings for active & passive sensors changed. Basically I'll spread the values out. Starting with a shallower "thermal layer" around 90m. the second around 130m, the third around 190m, the fourth around 220 and the fifth very deep at 260 or 270.

I would appreciate some feedback on this + I've got a couple questions for those more knowledgable than myself.
1.Inserting these 5 files in my existing 20 random folders makes the odds of stumbling into a thermal at 4:1. Are these odds too short? should I increase the percentage by increasing the number of random folders?
2.Was active pinging able to pierce the the thermal layer requiring that the Min Height= setting be deeper than the passive hydrophones? Or did the ping bounce off yet still allow some hydrophone detection meaning the active should be set shallower than the passive.
I do not want an absolute detection floor here. I'm looking for a bit of variation.

Also, keep in mind that there are 16 settings involved in both passive(8) & active(8) sound sensors. Some are early war and some are later. Each set can be can be edited differently. . In the above scenario perhaps 3 of 4 DD's has older sensors not able to pierce a 180m thermal but the remaing ship has a later model that will allow a bit deeper detection. The variations are limitles as you the U Boat Commander never knows which tyupe of sensor is fitted to the attacking ships above you.

http://rapidshare.de/files/14129754/...rs_Mod.7z.html

SH3 Commander-ready to use

http://rapidshare.de/files/14217696/Random.7z.html

02-19-06, 02:38 PM	#1
HEMISENT Ace of the Deep Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Northern Illinois Posts: 1,052 Downloads: 135 Uploads: 0	Work in Progress-Thermal layers...RELEASED Guys, ever since the pinpoint drops thread of a couple months ago I've given a good bit of thought to realism for the sake of realism v. realistic behavior. We are never going to get absolute 100% realism the way this game is modelled. The best we can hope for is to modify, edit or tweak different settings in the attempt to give us all a somewhat more realistic, immersive behaviour based on but not limited to historical values. One of the areas that was the subject of a lot of back and forth discussion going back to SHII days was thermal layers. I'm not getting into the part of whether or not they were charted, measured, able to be defined by the individual commander or even if they were an absolute ironclad way of escaping detection. The point I think we can all agree on is that they existed, they were located at different depths and the wise U Boat commander could use them to help get out of harms way if he was aware that his boat had entered into a thermal layer. At the end of the day they were a random element that could be useful in evading detection. Thanks to Redwine's words of encouragement for sort of getting me back involved in this. Here's what I've been working on: Right now using TT's mini tweaker I've edited the settings for all the active and passive sensor lines in the AI_Sensors.dat/Min Height =. By default these are all set at -300 For testing purposes I've set the active(sonar) at -200 and the passive(hydrophone) to -180. Testing this setting in the U 505 mission, once I've gotten the attention of the escorts I CD'd to 160m. The escorts were pinging like crazy making dc runs as normal. I crept down to 180m and noticed the green stealth meter begin to dirty up around 178 and go totally green in the low to mid 180's. If a DD began pinging the meter would instantly go red again.Creeping down to 200m with Escorts pinging the stealth meter again would dirty up just before 200 and continue to flicker until arounf 205m. The DD's continue to drop on the last, known position but eventually lose contact and disperse.After awhile knowing the pinging has ceased because the escorts are leaving I bring the boat back up. The meter stays green as I rise until I ordered ahead flank at around 190m and the meter again goes full red. Once I reduce speed the meter gradually goes back to green. I've run this with both the U 505 mission + a DD test mission I made. results are identical. Using the Random folder function in SH3 Commander I've now got a total of 20 random folders. I'm thinking I'll make 5 copies of the AI_Sensors .dat file. Each copy will have the Min Height= settings for active & passive sensors changed. Basically I'll spread the values out. Starting with a shallower "thermal layer" around 90m. the second around 130m, the third around 190m, the fourth around 220 and the fifth very deep at 260 or 270. I would appreciate some feedback on this + I've got a couple questions for those more knowledgable than myself. 1.Inserting these 5 files in my existing 20 random folders makes the odds of stumbling into a thermal at 4:1. Are these odds too short? should I increase the percentage by increasing the number of random folders? 2.Was active pinging able to pierce the the thermal layer requiring that the Min Height= setting be deeper than the passive hydrophones? Or did the ping bounce off yet still allow some hydrophone detection meaning the active should be set shallower than the passive. I do not want an absolute detection floor here. I'm looking for a bit of variation. Also, keep in mind that there are 16 settings involved in both passive(8) & active(8) sound sensors. Some are early war and some are later. Each set can be can be edited differently. . In the above scenario perhaps 3 of 4 DD's has older sensors not able to pierce a 180m thermal but the remaing ship has a later model that will allow a bit deeper detection. The variations are limitles as you the U Boat Commander never knows which tyupe of sensor is fitted to the attacking ships above you. http://rapidshare.de/files/14129754/...rs_Mod.7z.html SH3 Commander-ready to use http://rapidshare.de/files/14217696/Random.7z.html __________________ Nuke 'em till they glow!