[SeaQueen]

Originally Posted by MarkShot

In the spirit of "how do you" questions like "how do you sneak into a port", here is my contribution:

How do you escort a SAG and provide ASW security?

It really depends on what the SAG is doing. From what you described, I'm taking it the SAG is transiting at 10kts or was it doing something else? What kind of SAG are you talking about?

The problems I have with this type of scenario are:

(1) There are so many friendlies in the SAG that the sonar waterfall is totally cluttered with their noise. How am I going to find the faint single NB line that hints a sub it on the prowl?

The answer is provided by kinematics. There exists a thing called the limiting lines of approach. These describe the locus of all points within which a target can approach a given distance to your SAG. So long as you have sufficient sonar detection range to cover the arc within the limiting lines of approach, you should be okay. You might even be willing to accept less than 100% coverage, depending on how confident you are in the SAG at defending itself.

You also have to resign yourself to the fact that in this scenario, you are unlikely to be able defend against everything perfectly. In this case, I would let the SAG deal with any cruise missile shooters from the flanks. All you can hope to catch is the odd torpedo shooter coming from the center.

(2) I have to get sufficiently out in front of the SAG that I can take out an enemy sub before he launches weapons. Given all the noise the SAG (prop and active sonar) is making, I figure they must be identifiable at 30nmi or so. The problem is how do I get out in front of them fast and not turn myself into a target?

You don't.

I am going to need to sprints at 20+ kts or better. During those sprints I will be noisy and blind. I am certain that coming out of one of those sprints I will hear a TIW. (Of course, that may be a good way of smoking out a sub; if I survive - sort of an inverse recon by fire.)

We had a discussion earlier, where we came to the conclusion that sprint and drift was a bad tactic. There actually exists some mathematics to it, but unfortunately, it's one of those things that's hard to actually execute.

(3) What if while sprinting in #2, the enemy maintains his stealth and simply lays in wait for the SAG?

That's actually, probably the smartest thing he can do.

Or what if he makes his attack run from one of the flanks?

Without cruise missiles, attacking from the flanks is unlikely. With cruise missiles, it's unlikely you can defend anyway. This is really not a good situation for a submarine to be used.

(4) Oh, one more little wrinkle in this particular scenario. There is one other LA class sub also providing escort ASW. How do I avoid finding and killing him by accident while not waiting for a full ID to shoot?

Talk to him on underwater telephone? Other than that, you probably can't.

I guess that may be the easiest to answer - if the first NB line is 50Hz shoot; if 60Hz it is my sister ship.

If you get a 50Hz or 60Hz line. Some environments won't support that.