Quote:
Originally Posted by ZeeWolf
That fine NeonSam,
I was reading the page on Fred Leuchter and his credibility and on his testimony. Then I came across and read this page:
http://www.nizkor.org/hweb/people/l/...rsecution.html
I became outraged how this man was treated. There was nothing I read
that would even begin to justify this mans treatment no matter what he
said. Whether under oath on the witness stand or in public. If this Nizkor
organization is even remotely connected to those who carry out this
treatment on a man or condone such behavior or anyone who this crowd
denounces as a "Holocaust Denier" it totally undermines them as far as I
am concerned. |
Well for one thing I am very wary as to the veracity of anything coming from the IHR, and claims made by Fred Leuchter. He has already been proven to be a liar and a fraud in court. So his claims of persecution are also suspect. I have no doubt that he has not always been treated in the nicest fashion by people. But then he is associated with a known publisher of hate material (which that comes from also), and from all external evidence appears to be racist/antisemitic himself. So there will be people who will take a strong dislike to him. He is also certainly strongly motivated to lie about being persecuted, as it garners him attention and sympathy and helps spread his message.
http://www.nizkor.org/hweb/people/l/...uchter-05.html
http://www.nizkor.org/hweb/people/l/...hter-0195.html
About the IHR
http://www.nizkor.org/faqs/ihr/ihr-faq-01.html
One thing I will point out, that you may have noticed, is that Nizkor publishes everything, including the holocaust denial material. You cannot say the same for
any of the denial sites. This is the difference between honest discussion and debate, and what most holocaust deniers do, which is spread their own agenda (which unsurprisingly is hate related).
Like I said, I have no problem with open honest debate. I also prefer to refute claims rather than simply try to stifle them. Hence why I left the utter garbage posted by 'the_truth', rather than censoring it. I do however have little tolerance for blatant hate speech.
I am not trying to cow you or anything either, and I am only master of myself. I present rational arguments to your points when I disagree.
Quote:
You see I became a Christian after I heard that the disciples of Christ
where persecuted after the death and resurrection of Jesus. And their
crime - was saying publicly "Jesus rose from the dead!" No body I thought
would endure that level of persecution the disciples faced for a lie.
Therefore I hope you can understand my point here with Mr. Leuchter
Sincerely,
ZeeWolf
|
People do all the time though, on matters that they take on faith. All religions and organizations have their martyrs. People also do similar for political views (look at all the ardent nazi's, or the SS, many of whom fought to the death for their views). People are capable of an infinite level of self delusion in the end, and can latch on to anything no matter how absurd it appears to others.
I am not saying, though, that Jesus is or is not a lie, as I try not to stray too far into maters of religion. At least as long as said religion does not try to impose itself on me, or try to take away my own rights.
P.S. want to talk about persecution, take a look at the level of persecution many atheists put up with, even in this day and age.
