Quote:
Originally Posted by CCIP
6 million Jews. At the end of the day, the tens of millions dead in WWII are still "Hitler's" fault.
I think the other thing to consider is that as bad as Stalin was, he generally speaking wasn't genocidal (though in some instances it may be argued otherwise) but rather political in who he went after. Stalin's atrocities were also almost exclusively internal to the Soviet state system, and were carried out by millions of willing accomplices and informants within the society. They were not carried out (with some exceptions) by military invasion from the outside. Fundamentally, you can't separate what Stalin did with the politics and sociology of the Soviet system as a whole - terrible as it was, it was a civil affair (in the sense of being internal to civilian life in the USSR, not in the sense of being nice). Terrible as it is, I don't think it's appropriate to measure it by the same ruler as war crimes.
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Good post, recall there were 5 million others killled in the extermination and concentration camps.
http://www.holocaustforgotten.com/
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/...shVictims.html
Recall Hitler wanted to go East (and secure the West-as Feuer Frei pointed out he had no real quarrel with the Brits and hoped they would come to their senses after France was beaten in 1940) to deal with the Bolsheviks but also because it was the East that needed the most "cleansing" from Jews, Slavs and others...so the "Aryans" could have more land.
The only thing I can say is that the Nazis were very consistent in their view towards Jews and Roma-they all had to go. Slavs were a bit different however, Croatia, Slovakia, and Bulgaria were all slavic allies (Bulgaria also protected "their" Jews at least) many Western Ukrainians and even Russians (with Vlasov's ROA) fought on the German side etc.
Stalin killed for politcal ends and stopped when no longer "necessary" not very nice but more conducive to a longer lasting poltical system.
One thing we forget in these discussions is how much "help" these leaders have in commiting their crimes-none of the millions were personally killed by these or other leaders (though I've read Idi Amin actually did some killing himself). Would be good to find out more.