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Skybird · 08-21-10, 10:02 AM

http://www.spiegel.de/international/...712496,00.html

This is a german correspondent's view on how things are going in America. While it may be just one voice, since a longer time now almost all media over here seem to point out similiar views of a general trend that is unfolding since years.

I wonder what Americans think of this foreigner's view from the outside (with being outside being both an advantage and a disadvantage). Is the perception from the outside an allout flawed one, or does the author get his points right?

But do not try to just raise a flame war on a personally unwanted opinion. Give solid reasons, if you disagree. I am not launching this to raise a heated debate. I am just curuous on how Amerians react if bein confronted with percpetions and obwsevraitons on their country that may be seen as highly contradictory to the "official" ideological self-understanding of the US. none of what the author writes is in support of what is knwon to be the "American dream".

the recent initiative by ultra-rich people in the Us to distriubute major parts of their wealth, has caused a bitter discussion in Germany, illustrating that there are significant differences not only between libertarians/conservatives and socialists, but between the two countries in principal. what is taken queer by many over here - leaving a foul taste in our mouths - is the fact that donations like those beign offered in the US can be written off from obligatory tax duties, making thes e donations maybe much less altruistic than at first glance it seems - it means that in part private people makew the community pay-by-tayes for theirn own private donations, which emans these rich people enforcing without pltiallegitimation that according moneys get invested into purposes that they as a single private person have decided for. Writing off donations from taxes is not possible in Germany to the ammount that is possible in aer America. Also voluntary, unbinding wellfare, and mandtory social security systems are one of the most obvious major differencees between european cultures and American culture in general. While in principal I prefer the obligatory nature of the system in europe,I also see this very system being hijacked, exploited and abused for ideological politcal interests - which has made me moving away from the european model - at the same time avoiding th American model, too. honstely said, I do not know what to do about these things, to me both systems are seriously porked by now. the controversy about donations versus taxes has led the left to demand that they/the state (they hope to head) should not accept such donations, but should get the money nevertheless by raising mandatory taxes - so that the same money gets collected nevertheless, but not distributed by independant private will, but is being controlled by political institutions and ideologies (a motivation that pisses me off big time). For demagogues like to be found in poltival parties of every kind today, and ideological tranch warriors, private people taking responsibility and doing things for the community outside the control and planning of parties, simply is a vital thread to their own existence - it renders them obsolete and shows how little they are needed. On the othe rhand, pirvate donators usijng the american system just to direct public money into opportunities and purposes that they decide on, also is not acceptable, since they are not politically legitimised to do so.

are those ultra-rich donators just abusing a flaw in the system to avoid mandatory tax payments that threaten to come at them anyway?

08-21-10, 10:02 AM	#1
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,602 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	America on its way down. Is it? http://www.spiegel.de/international/...712496,00.html This is a german correspondent's view on how things are going in America. While it may be just one voice, since a longer time now almost all media over here seem to point out similiar views of a general trend that is unfolding since years. I wonder what Americans think of this foreigner's view from the outside (with being outside being both an advantage and a disadvantage). Is the perception from the outside an allout flawed one, or does the author get his points right? But do not try to just raise a flame war on a personally unwanted opinion. Give solid reasons, if you disagree. I am not launching this to raise a heated debate. I am just curuous on how Amerians react if bein confronted with percpetions and obwsevraitons on their country that may be seen as highly contradictory to the "official" ideological self-understanding of the US. none of what the author writes is in support of what is knwon to be the "American dream". the recent initiative by ultra-rich people in the Us to distriubute major parts of their wealth, has caused a bitter discussion in Germany, illustrating that there are significant differences not only between libertarians/conservatives and socialists, but between the two countries in principal. what is taken queer by many over here - leaving a foul taste in our mouths - is the fact that donations like those beign offered in the US can be written off from obligatory tax duties, making thes e donations maybe much less altruistic than at first glance it seems - it means that in part private people makew the community pay-by-tayes for theirn own private donations, which emans these rich people enforcing without pltiallegitimation that according moneys get invested into purposes that they as a single private person have decided for. Writing off donations from taxes is not possible in Germany to the ammount that is possible in aer America. Also voluntary, unbinding wellfare, and mandtory social security systems are one of the most obvious major differencees between european cultures and American culture in general. While in principal I prefer the obligatory nature of the system in europe,I also see this very system being hijacked, exploited and abused for ideological politcal interests - which has made me moving away from the european model - at the same time avoiding th American model, too. honstely said, I do not know what to do about these things, to me both systems are seriously porked by now. the controversy about donations versus taxes has led the left to demand that they/the state (they hope to head) should not accept such donations, but should get the money nevertheless by raising mandatory taxes - so that the same money gets collected nevertheless, but not distributed by independant private will, but is being controlled by political institutions and ideologies (a motivation that pisses me off big time). For demagogues like to be found in poltival parties of every kind today, and ideological tranch warriors, private people taking responsibility and doing things for the community outside the control and planning of parties, simply is a vital thread to their own existence - it renders them obsolete and shows how little they are needed. On the othe rhand, pirvate donators usijng the american system just to direct public money into opportunities and purposes that they decide on, also is not acceptable, since they are not politically legitimised to do so. are those ultra-rich donators just abusing a flaw in the system to avoid mandatory tax payments that threaten to come at them anyway? __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert. Last edited by Skybird; 08-21-10 at 10:13 AM.