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nodlew · 01-21-10, 01:11 AM

Your counter-points are taken, sir. Now that you mention the "Turtle," and the "Hunley," I remember that, historically, the US has been a seminal pioneer in the area of sub warfare. But, in my mind, I draw a sharp distinction between the Civil War Era US and Confederate navies and their tactics and philosophies (not to mention Revolutionary War Era US) and the US navy that began to fight the 2nd WWar. Distinction is a flimsy word for it. I don't think the two are really comparable--historically, geographically, nationally identical yes, but separated by a gulf of time and technological and political evolution which makes the latter a far distant relative of the former.
The "disdain" I speak of, refers to the attitudes of the entrenched Admiralty. Subs were viewed as, at best, sneaky weapons for the margins of the fleet. Support units to protect Battleships. Spy weapons. Sneak attack weapons. Too vulnerable and expensive, it was thought, for bold, aggressive tactics. Unlike the British (masters of the art of subterfuge), we Americans did not used to have such an affinity for "dirty trick warfare". Our faith has always been in supreme firepower. Simpler to disintegrate the enemy with overwhelming force, when you have that, than to outwit him. These are generalities of course with many exceptions.
At least, this is my impression--not a groundless one. But it turns out that between WWI and WWII, someone in the US Navy put a very high priority on developing extemely effective--the best in the world--submarines, to the point of creating a peerless torpedo fire-contrlol computer for them. Someone was thinking ahead. And that someone was thinking about doing to our next enemy exactly what the Germans did to GB in WWI--exterminating their merchant shipping. Immediately after the attack on Pearl Harbor, the order went out to commence unrestricted submarine warfare against the Japs. Unlike the Germans, who eased into Total War with England, we jumped into Total War with the Japs from the start. Of course we were sneak-attacked, and we were out for blood...but I think there was a strong element of racial hatred involved. Think? I know that was the case.
So, anyway, while we were going into WWII with no understanding of the critical importance of armor, or how to employ it in combined arms, without even the technical knowledge to mount a decent cal. gun in a tank turret, on the other hand, we had subs that were better than the U-Boot Ubermenches themselves. Huh? Go figure.

01-21-10, 01:11 AM	#4
nodlew Engineer Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Virginia Posts: 202 Downloads: 572 Uploads: 0	Re: Torplexed Your counter-points are taken, sir. Now that you mention the "Turtle," and the "Hunley," I remember that, historically, the US has been a seminal pioneer in the area of sub warfare. But, in my mind, I draw a sharp distinction between the Civil War Era US and Confederate navies and their tactics and philosophies (not to mention Revolutionary War Era US) and the US navy that began to fight the 2nd WWar. Distinction is a flimsy word for it. I don't think the two are really comparable--historically, geographically, nationally identical yes, but separated by a gulf of time and technological and political evolution which makes the latter a far distant relative of the former. The "disdain" I speak of, refers to the attitudes of the entrenched Admiralty. Subs were viewed as, at best, sneaky weapons for the margins of the fleet. Support units to protect Battleships. Spy weapons. Sneak attack weapons. Too vulnerable and expensive, it was thought, for bold, aggressive tactics. Unlike the British (masters of the art of subterfuge), we Americans did not used to have such an affinity for "dirty trick warfare". Our faith has always been in supreme firepower. Simpler to disintegrate the enemy with overwhelming force, when you have that, than to outwit him. These are generalities of course with many exceptions. At least, this is my impression--not a groundless one. But it turns out that between WWI and WWII, someone in the US Navy put a very high priority on developing extemely effective--the best in the world--submarines, to the point of creating a peerless torpedo fire-contrlol computer for them. Someone was thinking ahead. And that someone was thinking about doing to our next enemy exactly what the Germans did to GB in WWI--exterminating their merchant shipping. Immediately after the attack on Pearl Harbor, the order went out to commence unrestricted submarine warfare against the Japs. Unlike the Germans, who eased into Total War with England, we jumped into Total War with the Japs from the start. Of course we were sneak-attacked, and we were out for blood...but I think there was a strong element of racial hatred involved. Think? I know that was the case. So, anyway, while we were going into WWII with no understanding of the critical importance of armor, or how to employ it in combined arms, without even the technical knowledge to mount a decent cal. gun in a tank turret, on the other hand, we had subs that were better than the U-Boot Ubermenches themselves. Huh? Go figure.