[UnderseaLcpl]

Originally Posted by Tribesman

I say you have written a good example of total nonsense.
Lets start.

Firstly, I'd like to apologize for the tone of my last post. I intended to be direct but I think I came off sounding rather rude. I do that sometimes, please forgive me.

Now, without further adieu, let's start.

Where was that claimed?

Here?

the Rednecks moved to what is now the USA

They were crazy extremist backwards religious fundamentalists who wanted a new world order to purify the place against the ungodly global conspiracy.

Perhaps I misunderstood you. What did you mean to say?

But then again you appear cluless on the simplest of stuff.
Start with basic religion 101, can you tell the difference between a presbyterian covenanter and an anglican?
Maybe you should start with the bishops wars which were the start of the wars of the three kingdoms.

Maybe you should start with the causes of the wars and the animosity that fueled them. Religion itself was not the problem, it was the desire to impose religion upon others that begat the wars.

Actually once you explore that and the papist conspiracy theories of those days you can bring that up to date with a quick look at a real stereotypical redneck group. Try for example the Knights party from down south , you can't get more backwards redneck than the Klan can you , they call themselves good christians and have this conspiracy thing about a global popish plot(as well as a Jewish/communist/Islamic/socialist/liberal/negro plot that controls all the media)

I don't know anything about papist conspiracy theories, other than that the Catholic Church indulged in a number of questionable acts throughout its history. Thus, I can't really comment on that point.

Still, I can't really draw a comparison between covenanters and "rednecks". Other than strong pressure on the legislatures of states and the federal government for "moral" legislation like banning abortion and the the like(that's a stretch), and a desire for religious self-determination, I don't really see any similarities. I could just as easily draw a comparison between rednecks and Jews, or rednecks and Muslims. Could you clarify?

Errrrrr...covananters were called rednecks.

Really? By whom? I was under the impression that the term "redneck" was fairly modern American slang. The most recent example of the term that I know of came from the deep south in either the late 19th or the early 20th century(my memory is fuzzy on the topic)
If you know of an earlier example, I would be most intrigued.

And don't give me that wikipedia crap. Albion's Seed was written in 1989 and contains no credible reference to the term "redneck" being used to describe covenanters, other than Hackett's suggestion that the term may have been used, according to legend.

Wrong, the comparison made is of a bunch of modernday backwards nuts, another bunch of modernday backwards nuts and some historic backwards nuts.
This whole tangent has developed because some people simply don't know the origins of the term.

Well, I'd be most grateful if you could educate us with the proper etymology.

What I don't understand is how you can equate the desire for self-determination with "backwardness", unless you are indeed a product of socialist indoctrination.

Look up the origins for yourself , then for fun look up the schism with the Presbyterians in the 1840s in america which seperated the southern rednecks from those in the northern appalacians over an issue which was later to tear the country apart. If you explore that then you can tie it in very nicely with the picture of Rednecks that was posted.

You are suggesting that the schism in the Presbyterian Church between the "old" and "new" schools is somehow linked to the American civil war?
You think the civil war was started over slavery? You think that any of this excuses the state from declaring or supporting destructive wars and insurgencies, including those in Ireland?

In that case, I think I'll go kill a few people and say "religion made me do it".

That aside, you'll have to provide me with more information on the etymology of the term "redneck".

Originally Posted by UnderseaLcpl

He completely disregards the success of free societies in the modern world in favor of a dogma that has kept him and his people in the shackles of state control and religious violence.

When in doubt, rofl. What aspect of your nation's predisposition to religious violence is so funny, Tribesman? The rest of the world doesn't find it very funny.

Originally Posted by UnderseaLcpl

He has no idea why his nation is regarded as being "backwards" amongst other western nations, and he may not even realize why.

My mistake. Ireland is obviously a model of success. We should all strive to be as successful as Ireland. Why, oh why, didn't I see it sooner?

Two rather pathetic lines , after that your post just degenerates even further into complete nonsense that isn't even worth a laughing smiley.

What you mean is that you have no response, not even a laughing smiley.
You can't see beyond the walls around your mind. You strike me as being a fairly intelligent person, yet you cannot stoop to educating fools like myself. This tells me that you are not as educated as you have been led to believe, and that you cannot think for yourself.

Though it is tempting with this talk of backwardsness and dogma in the modern world to point at the fundamentalist religious right who have found a nice home with the republicans, or to have a good laugh at the creationists who insist the government should push their literal interpreatrion of scripture in science class in schools.

I can only hope that you're not referring to me, because I have never posted anything to indicate that I am a religious fundamentalist of any kind or a republican. I have also never indicated that I am a creationist.

For what it is worth, I am an economic conservative and a social liberal, which means that I believe in equal rights and very limited government. "Libertarian" is the term in the US. I have never advocated any kind of religious supremacy. In fact, I think the state has no place in marriage, schools, prisons, or any other institutions that religion has co-opted.

Your willingness to immediately assign me to the category of the "religious right" simply because I disagree tells me a great deal about you. It tells me that you have a number of leftist beliefs which have been ingrained upon, or willingly accepted, by you. It tells me that you will not tolerate dissent, which is a trait indicative of centrist and socialist governments and their peoples. It tells me that you cannot comprehend anything beyond what you have been taught by the state, which is to be expected of a citizen of Ireland, given the political atmosphere.

I will not pretend to be your intellectual superior, Tribesman. I won't even pretend to be right, but I will ask you to consider why your ideas often find so little purchase here. Is it because you are just so superior to the rest of us that we simply cannot comprehend your ideas? Or is it because there is something to self-determination and the rights of the individual?
Is your philosophy so great that there is no need to share it and debate it with mere mortals?

Personally, I think your ideas come from an ingrained socialist rhetoric. Perhaps you can show me some evidence that they have not.