[Sailor Steve]

I agree; people on all sides of all arguments get excited from time to time. I've come to a point in my life where even when I'm certain I'm right I still don't trust my judgement to be perfect, or even very good. I'm much more Conservative than Liberal, and believe that the government should go away and leave us alone, except to referee disagreements so we don't all kill each other. That said, I'm not convinced that some sort of socialistic welfare state isn't the best thing for a crowded modern society. I can't see it working, but has anybody honestly tried. The governments that have tried have been totalitarian in nature. Could it work in a democracy? I don't know. I'm afraid of the idea as much as most Conservatives and outright Libertarians. I just wish I could see an honest debate on the subject (or any other) rather than people who are so convinced of their rightness that they can't discuss it without trying to make the other guy look stupid.

This is why these days I argue the points less and concern myself more with the honesty of the arguments being used.