SUBSIM Radio Room Forums - Wait, are red lights a myth?

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Wait, are red lights a myth?

Quote:

A design study of the Type IXC uboat based on U505, dated 1946 and conducted by the U.S. Portsmouth Naval Shipyard, notes in chapter S64…

"In addition to the above the indicating face plates of practically all I.C. equipment, important gauges, meters, etc., particularly in the Control Room are treated with phosphorescent material so that they may easily be read in the event of a complete casualty to the lighting power supply. The number of units so treated in the Control Room provides enough illumination to allow personnel to move about freely.
Additional fixtures for low level illumination, either blue or red, are not provided for dark adaptation of the ship’s personnel. Use is made, however, of tightfitting red lens goggles."

Having no access to original study I can't verify this of course, and anyway it might just be the way it was done on Type IX's or even just this particular boat, but if true, this would mean that there was actually no red lighting inside U-Boat that we are so used to in all games and movies?

You might find this conversation over at the Cruisers Forum interesting.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kapuhy (Post 2774548)

So, I was doing some googling on lighting inside U-Boats after recent somewhat heated discussions here about various U-Boat interior mods, and found something that really surprised me:

https://uboat.net/forums/read.php?3,...5810#msg-95810

Having no access to original study I can't verify this of course, and anyway it might just be the way it was done on Type IX's or even just this particular boat, but if true, this would mean that there was actually no red lighting inside U-Boat that we are so used to in all games and movies?

i would said depends on the years early war they probly use red light later war maybe you got to take into account 505 capture in june of 44 if i remember right

Speaking about red light in the context of vision adaptation, you also need to keep in mind the issues of masking:

"THE SUBMARINE COMMANDER'S
HANDBOOK ("U.Kdt.Hdb.") 1942 New Edition 1943:

133.) The underwater attack is also practicable at dawn and dusk, and on moonlit nights. In these cases, the following points should be observed:

a) Complete blacking out of the conning tower and the control room is necessary, as otherwise the light is still reflected, to a considerable extent, in the periscope. "

The red light in the control room and conning tower can serve as a blacking measure to the extent that the crew can effectively carry out their duties at battle stations.

Yes, I get the purpose of using red light and I know that it was indeed used historically on submarines, the question is if it was used specifically on German U-Boats during Battle of Atlantic?

Digging more on the subject, I found this:

https://www.forum-der-wehrmacht.de/i...t-beleuchtung/

Discussion is in German so I have to rely on Google Translate a bit, but the gist of it is:

- Specifications of Type VII, XB, and XIV U-Boats do not mention any installation that would allow or be intended to switching to red lighting.
- Only mention of blue light is in torpedo firing procedures, where switching on a blue light is signaling that bearing is currently not passed to torpedoes through torpedo calculator. In other words, it's an indicator light not a lighting system
- only mention of switching to different lighting in diving/silent running procedures is command to lower the voltage on lights from 110V to 90V to prevent lightbulbs bursting as result of voltage spikes during depthcharging
- only "night light" mention refers to night lamps mounted in officers and NCO's quarters, and from context they are probably means to allow officers to read when main lights are switched off
- There's also mention (with link that sadly is dead now) of Lothar-Günther Buchheim mentioning red light in "Das Boat" as creative license on part of the movie director. This would further support the notion that Germans simply didn't use such lighting.

It's very easy to find sources confirming using red light on US fleet boats. Indeed, it's enough to google a photo of American boat to see two separate sets of light bulbs, one red and another white:

https://c8.alamy.com/comp/T6N394/mai...usa-T6N394.jpg

Meanwhile, you can see interior of surviving Type VII in Laboe here:

https://www.360cities.net/image/subm...ommand-central

I don't see any similar system with different lighting visible here.:hmmm:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alpheratz (Post 2774595)

"THE SUBMARINE COMMANDER'S
HANDBOOK ("U.Kdt.Hdb.") 1942 New Edition 1943:

133.) The underwater attack is also practicable at dawn and dusk, and on moonlit nights. In these cases, the following points should be observed:

a) Complete blacking out of the conning tower and the control room is necessary, as otherwise the light is still reflected, to a considerable extent, in the periscope. ".

The above quote, to me, suggests that instead of turning on some special night light system, the procedure was to simply turn off lights in control room and conning tower during night attacks (which wolud line up nicely with mention of phosphorescent layer on gauges and switches needed to operate the boat which, according to that quote, allowed for normal operation in case of lighting failure)

One way to shed light on this would be to send a PM to the dev team of "Crush Depht". They are in contact with the real chief engineer of U-96, Friedrich Grade, who is 105 years old and a special expert for "CD".

Either the devs have already asked the LI about the lighting or they might do it.

https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/sho...d.php?t=247462