Data Protection/EU Privacy Debate
 

Today my Avast box popped up with this link, so read on.

http://www.spiegel.de/international/...-a-877973.html

Excuse me but I don't trust the EU in its present form one bit.

Me neither.
anything i do on a pooter is either for fun or for work.

Fun related stuff can access the net.
Work related stuff is done either in a closed evironment with no net-related connections whatsoever, or on the work network altogether.

Sensitive data, like banking, shopping, exchange of spicy mails and anything i do not want other people to know, i do not trust the computer either.

Banking is done in persona, shopping is done by other people, and spicy and intimate stuff is done on a physical level.

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Some thoughts.

Good. what's wrong?

You have internet access? you have an ISP.
Your ISP usually gives you 2/4 GB mail access.

You don't have Internet access?
Your local ISP may wnat to offer mail hosting services fora few bucks, so that you can check on the mails from an internet café.

--> money flows from Google to local businesses.





just what i think would be a fun turn in things.

who is these people we are speaking about here? the german or italian postal office or ISPs?
vague.



Web giants shall remain web giants.

Irrelevant. You screw up; you pay the price. The user is the one responsible for his actions.
Anything you put on the web can and WILL at some time be possibly held against you.
The Databases do not forget, the Databases are not yours.

A good idea, for those concerned, but one that takes responsibilities away from the citizen.
And thus bad, because it diminishes the awareness of your actions.

seems okay. common rules for everybody in the EU, accessible in one place.
is there a catch?

True. piece for piece, like a puzzle, you are profiled on the networks. Till the big companies have a picture of who you are, what you usually do, where you go, buy eat and work on.
and these databases do not forget.
they only complete the picture about you.

...what for? what is their goal?

Opt-in vs Opt-out?
The user chooses what is personal, what is business, what is private what is not?

since all this is messy, and since LAWYERS are involved to break and overrule your decisions, keep everything as private. do not spread info on the net,
-because it will be caught,
-assebled
-and not forgotten.

do not buy online, unless you want amazon to track you.
go to your bookstore, and have thsm do it for you.
do not sell on ebay unless you want to be profiled.
sell locally by posting an ad in a newspaper.

case A)
case B)
none of them makes for a good rule, as the end user, be he a small private dude/ dudette, or a Company and small business,
will still give decision power away.

To "The EU" or "To Google" makes no difference.
Its like crapping in the hand and clapping in the other.

the solution is to keep in mind the networks catch it all, assemble profiles and never forget.
be anonymous.
be reponsible.
be local.
be.

We may not be in it much longer.

Which doesn't mean that's a bad thing, despite what the money driven companies are trying to make us believe.

I wish more countries would say enough is enough.
I don't trust my own government, let alone the EU.
Democracy has become a hollow word, but that's my humble opinion.

It's just too big to be believable.
on a small geographic continent, you have such small things like countries and ethnic groups...
Puttingthem in one pot and trying to merge them into one... under the ideology of "peace for all" ... was never going to work.

I expect the EU to fall apart slowly during the next decade anyway.

We all know what will come out of it, as seen with countless other EU legislation :shifty:

Facebook and Google can cry a river all they want, all they should do is to respect the exicting data proptection laws, be transparent with the individual date they collected and quite some practices, e.g. persinstent tracking cookies, hidden in the like button all over the net.
If they can't follow the same rules countless other companies can, then bye-bye. The European market is too big to them to be neclected, so the threat to leave Europe is all typical lobby blackmailing bs.

What would this law provide for a country like Germany with already pretty strict data protection laws? A setback.
We don't have the right "to forget data", we have the right that the individual can insist have his collected personal data deleted - a very important difference.
So like with most EU laws: thanks, we don't need them, however this never stopped our glorious regime from putting those into law anyway...:-?

When will the people of Europe rise and tear down the EU's social-fascist dictatorship like the people of Hungary, Poland, East Germany and Czechoslovakia have brought down their tyrant regimes 23 years ago? Why have people forgotten the lessons learned from the GDR and the USSR? The EU runs by the same mechanisms of never legitimized but usurped power like these two regimes did. How comes that this has already been forgotten again - less than just one generation later?

Maybe it is because people function by the same rules and leaders crave for power by the same rules as ever. There I have read so much by and about my beloved Machiavelli, and when his exquisit descriptions recommend themselves again to explain the present - I just forget to think about them. Stupid me!

Jubilee!. 500 years ago, Machiavelli pretty much founded what could be labeled as the beginning of political science. Different to philosophers and dreamers before him, he did not care to dream about what policy and state should be like, but he cool-mindedly described how the mechanisms of securing and gaining power function. That'S what made him different to everybody before him, and that is what makes him a master in his field until today.

Why do I get the feeling that these new laws will affect me here in Norway, despite Norway not being a member of EU?

Because your economy, like the Swiss economy, depends on the EU market and thus you must follow EU regulations dictated by Brussel to a wider degree than one would imagine, considering that Norway is not EU member.

I wish Britain, Germany and Finland would leave the EU, and together with Finland would form a new northern economy zone - that leaves it to economic coordinating, nothing more. The Poles economically would be fine to join, and the Dutch financially - but both political establishments in these countries are far too Europhile for my taste. But Britain, Germany, Finland and Norway - that would be something! :yeah: About the Czech I am not sure, even more so after the recent presidential election. Klaus may have been a strong EU critic, but the new guy is quite left and won by dirty tricks and plenty of anti-German ressentiment-raising, which obviously fell on fertile ground in parts of the Czech population. Why would I welcome that... And no, no France, please. No country in Europe by mentality is as socialistically oriented as the French. Let'S leave it to pragmatic temporary deals one a day-to-day basis, as a longterm ally I do not trust them anymore. The often announced Franco-German "axis" is seriously desintegrating since quite some time now.

Also not certain about the Danes, do not know their economy and EU attitude well enough.

Data protection Laws undermine this business.
Collecting Data by all means necessary is the CORE reason d'etre for web companies like Farcebook.
they are not there to provide, offer, give.. not for free.

Therefor their business is to step over the border and just ignore the rules.
Or sign the agreements and still do what they want.

Who will go and check their servers? the EU? the individual countries? Police departments' IT section? It is not going to happen.

Facebook does not care. The EU does not really care, because they are politicians who need votes...

The one that should care and use his brain is the user.
Nothing is free. "There is no such thing as free breakfast".

With SHV's DRM, people screamt "vote with your wallet!!"

yet, now with a similar "carrot and stick" situation, the userbase it crying and b*tching...??!
The fact that such debate even takes place is "Userfail"

on a VERY large scale.:yeah:

Unfortunately the banks themselves use computers to convey information to each other. I don't think I'm any less safe doing my banking online. My check is deposited into the bank online, I buy stuff online, and I check my status online. What the bank does is create channels by which I can make quick claims if something doesn't look right, and take the responsibility if I'm right. Just because you go there in person doesn't mean someone else can't steal your money with a computer anyway.

Google and facebook are good tools for insurance companies to reject claims, the "like" button is magic.

true.

But the less i do online, the less failures by networks i can encounter.
i check my status online, and do all my transactions offline. i take half a day off every month for paperwork, banking , collecting and depositing parcels every month.

because i do not trust the web, the delivery services, "it has been deposited with your neighbor, mister ashat".

And by going banking in persona, i promote the human factor, and give the guys and gals at the cash counter a reason d'etre too. We do our thing and chat for a second.
They know me, and they know my financial status / mess over the last few years. They offer me advice, and i can read on their faces if that advice is honest and in relation to saving y butt cheeks, or just "doing their job at promoting a product"

Okay, i admiit - they look behind the customer, and have an intimate knowledge of my cashflow. more than they should have. But i know where their car is parked and where their house lives.

We can respect each other.
Try that with amazon or Mister Zuckerberg and his cronies.
Or that Kim Dotcom guy.

Do we need the EU to oversee us?