Fall of the rising sun! "Copyrights"
 

Hi folks! As some of you know we released our mod pack "Fall of the rising sun!" in germany some weeks ago.

Now a german pc games magazine asked if they could release this modpack on a cd which is part of their magazine. They asked for copyrights. So my question is:

Is there anybody who is listed in the readme who does not want to release his mod which is part of "FOTRS" on a german pc game magazine? (www.pcgames.de)

We and they do not earn money with our and your work. It just a free gift for their readers.

Please tell us if one of you does not want to give his permission.

Here you will get the readme.

I see my seafloor mod is part of the mod, which is okay.

But I'm a little twisted about this "deal". By this, I mean: let's say they don't raise the usual price of the magazine just because of this "free gift".
But will they gain more readers this month (meaning selling more issues) because of it? Because then they will sell more magazines and thus earning more money.

Then again, how about the price for our consent is a free copy of the magazine sent to all mod contributors? Just an idea. For me, it ain't a problem with the language, but I suppose others would have their linguistic difficulties...

Though, it's still nice that they ask in advance and just don't take it and publish it anyway like others did in the past...

Hi Carotio,

i dont think that they will sell more magazines when they include FOTRS on her big DVD.
They always put an freewaremod on her DVD, sometimes some mods for C&C, Battlefield, COD4 and so on. Most mods they supported are mods for mainstream-games.

Dont worry, the deal is not done in this moment and we from AOTD will not earn any money for this. This deal only can bring us a little bit publicity.
The Idea with the free copy for all mod contributors is an nice one !
We will talk about that with the magazine-people.

Greets

Maddy

Is Corsair going to be included in the version on DVD? I see from screenshorts that rockets/racks from my Air Attacks mod are used for it but I do not find that credited in the credits section of Readme.

Here comes a potential can of worms. The last line of that credits file says:

“Fall of the rising sun” is open source freeware, made by the SH3/SH4 modding community.

That's a bit confusing, as 'Open Source' may be interpretted as the Open Source Licence, which allows commercial use, re-sale and also charging a fee for redistrubution, as many of the authors of the mods used in FOTRS explicitly restrict commercial use of their mods, the open source licence cannot be used and may lead to confusion. Open Source is also not compatible with the definition of Freeware.

It may also be a good idea to add in after saying it's freeware that FOTRS may be distributed free of charge and may not be sold commercially, just to make it clear, unless you have already included a non-commercial freeware license elsewhere in the ditribution.

I'm happy for my little mod to be used, as long as the original readme is included in the distribution.

I've been reading this with a little bit of worry. I'm no lawyer, and I could very well be wrong, but it is my understanding that if you sign the "Copyrights" over to them, they now own it, lock stock and barrel, period, done deal. That means that if they decide they want to turn around and make money off of it you no longer have any say in the matter at all. It is now theirs to give away or sell to whomever they please. That's what "Copyright" means.

But that's just as I understand it; I don't know that for sure.

I have looked at this to and it looks like some of my work is included in the mod, some of the terrain textures and allso Jaketoox's water shader from ROW / PE is included. However my name or Jaketooxs is not mentioned anywhere, LeoVampire is credited which is great, but me and Leo and JakeToox and Is4htl worked very close together to make ROW.

Anyway good luck with the deal if they are not making any money out of it, except selling more magazines, then fine, but if your mod suddenly end up on a CD called something with X.... (don't mention it! someone says to me :lol: ) then we have the same issue all over again.

EDIT: here is the original credits list from ROW if you want to use it:

i would strongly advise not allowing this magazine to have Copyright on the material. There is absolutely no need for them to have it. Many gaming magazines provide freeware on their included discs but do not own the copyright, simply go out and buy a copy of PC Gamer and you will see.

SO the fact that they are asking for copyright should worry you a great deal. You will effectively be signing over the interllectual property rights of your work and they will be free to do as they wish with it.

:nope:

I haven't heard any details of this request for putting it on the DVD, but i think it's not like "Could we have the copyrights?", it's more like "Do we get your permission to put it on our next DVD?".
The Reason why Nemo asked is probably that we had some issues with "copyrights" or "credits" with FOTRS in the past. So by asking before agreeing to the magazines request he asked if anyone would have a problem with this.

But as i said before i don't know exactly what the deal would be - but i don't think that Nemo or MadMax would give away the full copyright etc. just for nothing.

So, the main question is "Do you have anything against this: the mod is released on the magazines next DVD and they don't take extra money for it (except for more sells) and we don't get any money from them. (and no copyrights etc. are changed)"

my thought about this...
Phil

Well, now I'm confused. I assumed that the original post was asking the copyright holders for permission to distribute, rather than the actual copyright. The readme says that the copyright for the mods belongs to the original authors, so that's where I got that from. But reading the OP again, I see it does say that they are asking for copyrights, but I think I may have put that down to a turn of language.

As far as signing copyright over, that would need a physical signature and contract with a nominal payment of say $1 and unless that happens the original authors own the copyright. Rights cannot be claimed for any part of the work that is taken from a previous work. So, with some mods being created by modifying orignial work by Ubisoft, to which they own the copyright, then the copyright to such mods are jointly owned by Ubisoft and the mod creator.

What is OK though is to look at the license distributed with each mod. If the readme says that you can do whatever you like with it, no problems. If it says you can't use it no matter what, then you can't use it, unless you get the author's explicit permission. Most mods says freely distribute, but not for commercial use, but include the original readme. If anything stated in the readme isn't followed, then the mod isn't licensed for use in that way. If the readme says no, that's it, unless you get an OK afterwards and asking if anyone disagrees with distributing it isn't getting permission. This is the way software distributed over the internet is handled and it seems to work quite well as long as everyone sticks to the licenses.

Carotio brings up the point of would it be a commercial use for PC Games.de to use the mod on a cover disc, or would it count as a way to distribute the mod to an audience on a DVD which they would be buying anyway.

I for one would take a view that distribution on a cover disc is more likely to be fair distribution, rather than a way to make money, although perhaps there will be one person who buys the mag that perhaps otherwise wouldn't. Even so, if the magazine were to simply review the mod, then someone may buy the mag to read the review. So as long as they don't outright sell it, which they aren't licensed to do...

Still, this is the can of worms that I was worried about :D .

EDIT: I'm only posting this to help clarify some of the concerns. A lot of people get very anxious when this sort of stuff crops up. I'm not trying to start an argument or anything, so don't shoot me!

As long as it's clear that the resultant distribution does not allow the mods to be reused in a commercial project I'd not have a problem. I can't sort that out right now, however (my exception would be the actual SH4 devs, they can have anything of mine they wish)

No Permission
 

Hi CaptainNemo,

This MODS are from me:

Nautilus42
- German Typ IX D 2 AI-Submarine
- DSD-File for Deutschland-Class Cruiser and Hoogs Island freighter
- Skins for Aux.subchaser / Old Corvette
- NCV Shinano
and I will give you not my Permission, that PCGames release it at their DVD in their Magazine. I modded only for the Comunity for free, but PCGames makes money with our MODS. AOTD_Fotrs can used my Mods in their Mods, but if AOTD will release his FOTRS on a PCGames_DVD, you will have not my Permission, when my MODS include their.

IN KLAREN DEUTSCH: NEIN!!! :nope: :nope: :nope:

greets

nautilus42

Hi Sergbuto,

the rockets are not an content of the released german version of FOTRS.
They should be an content of the english version and for an german upgrade.
The credits for this new mods we used will be given in the upgrade or in the english version.
At this time iam starting an "permission-journey".
Ju 88 give me his permission for using the B17.
The Corsair is an selfmade one just like the Nakajima Ki 44.
A already asked the publisher of the ASW-Airlayermod for permission to use 3 of the ASW-Planes and the ASW Bombs-Air but 3 weeks are gone with no answer.
Sometimes it is very hard to find and contact the builder of some Mods, much harder as to build the same thing by your own. :damn:
So now i have to ask you for permission to use your racks which i have found in the spanish 24 Flottilla mod.


Back to Topic.

The magazine dont want the copyrights for all mods which are included in FOTRS.
They say that they need the permissions of all modders for including FOTRS on the Freeware DVD.
But in this case it is better to talk with Captain Nemo.
He got more informations of this cause he is the one who stays in contact with the magazine.
The Magazine got FOTRS from the german UBI-Forum where they have downloaded it for free.

Greets

Maddy