Setting up for convoys?
 

I've got a few convoy-related questions for all the experienced captains here:

1. When you encounter a convoy, do you do your best to sink every ship? Or do you sink the larger boats and get away?

2. Once a convoy is alerted to your presence, they start zig-zagging all over the place, and they usually increase their speed a little. Let's assume that you missed one of your targets, and the convoy knows you're out there somewhere. How do you get back into position to try and hit the convoy again? It's nearly impossible to overtake them underwater (without your battery running out), and if you surface, you'll get shot at.

3. Let's assume that I'm in prime position for an approaching convoy. I'm facing them (at a 90 degree angle) and they pass by me. Obviously, I want to take out as many of these ships as possible. I launch two or three torpedoes at one ship, then launch a torpedo or two at a few of the smaller ships. When the first torpedoes hit the first ship, the rest of the convoy will begin taking evasive maneuvers, increasing the odds that the torpedoes you fired at smaller boats will miss. How do folks here handle firing at multiple targets in a convoy? Or do you single out one ship and go for that?

If it helps, I'm not using any mods, and I'm not using manual targetting (which I know increases the difficulty greatly). Please forgive a newbie like myself for these transgressions. :88)

1. To stick with the actual wartime doctrine, I try to go for the tankers first. Then the larger ships. But sink whatever you can depending on your position and approach.

2. US Subs would perform an 'end-around.' An end-around was a manuever where the sub would be just out-of-sight over the horizon and would use their superior surface speed to get ahead of the convoy and submerge for another attack. This is easier in the later years, once you get radar installed.

3. Determine which targets will require a longer run time then try to fire your torpedoes where the first torpedo at each target hits simultaneously or at least within a several seconds of each other.

Happy Hunting!:ping:

Depends on the convoy. In most cases, my priority targets are, of course, the larger vessels. Sometimes not, though, as I might have recieved orders to go after a specific kind of vessel or even the escorts. If so, I plan my attack accordingly.

In my experience, trying to get back in position immediately following an attack is useless. However, think long term: There's nothing to prevent you from breaking contact, doing an end around, and attacking again once the convoy has reformed. Sometimes I shadow convoys until nighttime or rough weather to make the attack easier, too. Best to be patient in a submarine.

When firing at multiple targets, fire your fish at the most distant target first. This will give the torpedoes time to get most of the way to the target before the convoy is alerted.

Sometimes, though, it can be best to center your attention on a single target. Remember, it's better to sink a little than to damage a lot.

Interesting thread.

How about when you are using manual targeting, is there any method to hit more than one ship in one attack? I read the sort of turorial about the Dick O'kane method by Rocking Robins but still not sure about how to do it.

Since we are at it, what's the best way to avoid the scorts, can I let them go over me if I'm deep enough, is it better to be inline with them to show a thinner profile to the sonar or it doesn't matter?

Thanks for your comments

Greetings fellow captains,

Using TM and manual targeting, I rarely am able to take more than one ship for a givin convoy attack...I'm just not good enough. Occasionally I'll be able to get a fore and stern shot off...but more often than not, I just end up wasting fish. I would recommend, however, if you do want to try to multiple targets, to fire your first salvo on slow speed, and your second on higher speed...that way you can get fairly simultaneous hits and their chances for evasion are less.

Regarding escorts...TM has some wicked destroyers. My old method of lining up at a 90 at periscope depth caused my boat some brutal depth chargings. Now I find I have to go deep, run silent, and slim my profile as much as possible. Of course, this leaves precious little time to collect torpedo data...but oh well! Hope this helps a little.

Good hunting!

Howler :arrgh!:

Manual targeting is both a bitch and a very rewarding experience, once you start using it you will realize that half the game lies in it and you'll never go back. Personally I lie in ambush and try to get the best target. And if in the confusion another presents itself on my way out, one more with the aft tubes. If there is another I MUST have, I will stalk the convoy again.

As for escorts, yes go deep and keep a low profile (cross section) and crawl your way out to open sea. Do not take evasive action unless you believe that charges are bieng dropped or will be dropped directly on your position. As long as you remain quiet the escorts will rush your last known position and try to "guess" your location.

My 2 cents: When attacking convoys i always go for the biggest priority or the biggest ship, usually these are tankers or passenger ships. I dont really bother with the small ones because you can find those away from convoys and attack rather easily.

I set up for a 90 degree shot but i go to a depth of around 230 or 250 depending on depth capability/hull integrity and so on. I creap into the convoy on silent running and battle stations and listen for the destroyers on my hydraphone to hear when they have passed overhead, then i go to periscope depth, quickly pick out my target with perisope ahead and behind me, always set up your torps before hand to depth and speed. Then i fire at the farthest ship away then closest if possible, hit 250 depth and run in opposite direction of the convoy to get away from the destroyers. If i survive the depth charges, i surface and depending on how my fuel is and amount of torps i have i will make an end around to try my luck again.

Just so you know an end around is sort of like this. Imagine a 4 lane highway and the convoy is on the far right lane, you want to get over in the far left lane and pass them by a long safe distance then cut over 90 degrees and set up for the attack. Good lluck to you mate.

FWIW, these are some of things I do to reacquire a convoy after I have attacked...

As Capt Vlad said, patience is the key. Rushing back into the attack when there are alerted escorts will just get you killed! Without radar, reacquiring the convoy can be hit and miss (just like it really was), but with some educated guesswork you should be able to find it again.

The increased visibility range with the 1.4 patch makes the 'end around' a little easier - you can maintain sight of the convoy from a greater stand-off distance.

Before you attack take note of the base course and speed the convoy is travelling on - it gives a good first reference point for when you resume your search. The convoy may have changed course but should still be heading in the same general direction towards its original destination.

Listen on the hydrophones to find out what bearing(s) the convoy is on - this will also give you an indication of which direction is is going.

When you have successfully evaded/eluded any escorts, listen on hydrophones and/or take a cautious look with the 'scope and see which direction the escort is heading, as that heading will likely lead you straight back to the convoy.

Be careful with this though as the escorts can be cunning (I use TM mod, don't know about stock) and lie doggo near your last known position - you can't hear them on the hydrophones. If you surface without first doing the proper checks you are likely to get a face full of shells, small arms and depth charges!!:o I've found that if there are multiple escorts, one seems to remain behind or position itself between your last suspected position and the convoy to keep you away, whilst the remainder return to the convoy. If that is the case try and get the bearing the ones returning are travelling on as this will likely lead you back to the convoy.

Good luck and good hunting!!

Cheers

I have recently seen a convoy with 4 escorts leave one behind at the site of the attack for over half an hour, lying at dead stop just waiting. This is without Trigger Maru, just the 1.4 patch and a couple of visual mods installed.

In SH3, tankers would be my top priority, however in this one they are near the bottom because they are so damned hard to sink! If there are any large passenger ships or troop transports they're first, followed by cargo ships in descending order of size. Every time I shoot at a tanker in SH4, they absorb the hit and keep right on going. I suppose it's understandable; a tanker is designed to sail with just as much liquid inside as outside the hull, so exchanging its cargo for water doesn't really make a lot of difference in the ship's floatation status. Occasionally I've found one that must have been carrying something volatile like gasoline that goes up from a single hit, but in SH4 it typically takes me between 4-10 detonating torpedoes to sink one large tanker.

If you're shooting from long distance (5-8 thousand yards), there's enough time to fire your forward torpedoes at the leading ships, turn 180°, and fire the rear torpedoes at the trailing ships before the first impact. It's unlikely that the convoy is wide enough that you can fire the forward torps at low speed, rotate, fire the rear torps at high speed, and have them all impact within a 15-20 second period though. This means some of the rear torpedoes will likely miss due to evasive action on the part of the ships.

When attacking convoys I go for the biggest takets first (large merchants, Tankers - large and medium) I shoot at them from the most distant first to the nearest last, time the torps so that they arrive at around the same time. This means that there is less chance of a target being warned of an incoming torpedo when the first one hits. When I fire a 6 torpedo salvo at multipule targets all topedoes will arrive within 10 to 20 seconds of each other.:up:

in a convoy situation most of the data except range and bearing are identical. there is no need to set up a new speed track or target course once you have a damn good idea of what the covoy is doing. so identification is the only real issue.

identify the two or three you want to shoot at first. then picka shoot order usually farthest to closest. i then develop data on the closest ship since it is the easiest to track. once that is done your target coarse and speed is the same for each target . just fire ont he farthest one then pick the next send range and bearing make sure the target coarse has not changed on the aob setting then fire and do the next and so on. if done accurately all should hit at the same time.

Thanks for the tip Jetthelooder! I'll give it another shot on my next patrol...

Depends on the conditions. If it's raining and foggy, I go in on the surface at the TDT with the guns manned. At such short range, it's hard to miss.

At night, I'll sneak past the destroyers (sometimes on the surface if I can figure out their plan) then torpedo as many of the central ships as I can. As the destroyers head inward I head to the rim of the convoy again and fire again. Repeat as many times as possible.

During the day, I often approach one of the destroyers on the surface, and just let him see me enough so that he moves towards me. I think if the escorts get a certain distance away, the convoy stops moving; so while only one destroyer tries to work me over I go to the center and torpedo the biggest ships I can find. If it's night, I sometimes risk it by popping up in the center with the deck gun, or if it's still day, I just submerge at silent running and move as quickly as I can away from the destroyers.

My convoys tend to just stop while the escorts head for me...Hmm. Well, what I would do is to stay just out of visual range, or barely inside, and on the surface. When they slow down to cool their heels attack them again.

If you're lucky you can avoid this situation altogether by getting well ahead of the convoy you're attacking. Thus you may get a salvo from the bow and stern tubes before he gets to you. Then just surface and use the deck gun at close range; your silouhette is too small for many of the merchant guns to hit well. And any escorts will also have trouble shooting past their own ships, to the center of the convoy.

Attacking the destroyers with the deck gun always works too; seems to slow them down/piss them off/sink them.

I try to avoid this situation altogether; I've discovered that in this manner it's rare to sink more than one ship. Rather, try to get so that you are looking down a line of enemy ships (Preferably, from the bow, but diagonal works well too, definetly not stern though). Then increase speed and decrease the distance so that all the ship's targetting "arrow" is green. Fire all your torpedoes at the ship closest to you in that line. With luck, if any of those miss, the ones behind it stumble right into them.

Hoped these helped!

P.S. I'm playing on "normal" difficulty level, so that may be below your skill level, I don't know

Hello captains,

Surface the thread!!! ;)

Really good advice here on how to attack a convoy and try to sink more than one target using manual targeting: going down deep, silent running and thin profile to avoid scorts both in your way in and out. Shooting the farthest ship first and then the closest using slow speed for the torpedos in the first round and fast in the second. And of course in a convoy the ships go at the same speed and keep the same course.

With all this info I have tried a couple attacks with the following results:

1- Small convoy, three merchants, no scorts, the one in the middle is too small so I go for the first and last; positive identification of the ships; determine the speed and course of the first ship and set it in the TDC, this info won't change when attacking next target; set up of the torpedos, two at slow speed for the first target, two fast for the second; when the first ship is in a good firing position fire the slow fishes in a spread of two degrees; send the mast height of the next ship to the TDC, it's already preselected in the identification book; determine bearing and distance using the stadimeter, and send two fast torpedos to the ship.

The first target gets hit before I can finish sending the torpedos for the second, so it starts turning straight away too early for my torpedos, still the first torpedo hits "It's a dud Sir" :damn: but the second one misses. The outcome is first target two good hits and stopped still needs a few rounds of the deck gun; second target one dud hit and running like crazy.

The problem seems to be that I went for the closest ship first, even using the correct combination of slow and fast torpedos wasn't enough.

2- Two merchants, no scorts, this time I follow the same pattern but wait for the first shipt to pass by me and go away a little bit, so when both ships are at mostly the same distance from me, start the attack, same as before but only one torpedo for the second ship; to my surprise and great joy both ships get hit nearly at the same time :arrgh!: one of the two torpedos aimed to the first ship is again a dud, but one is still enough the bring her to full stop, the second ship is going very slow (1 - 2 kt) with most of the bow underwater, she goes down on her own after a few minutes, the other needs a few rounds to go down too.

All in all these experiences were great, lets see how it goes when there are scorts around.

Thanks again to all those who help me with their comments here.

Over and out.

Where the ships in line? Why did you make a new solution? Can't you use the same solution for ships in line like in SH3?