AA Lethality?
 

Mein Gott!!!
Some yahoo with an AA HMG did 12% dmg to my sub!!


Are you out of yer cotton pickin minds??!

WHATS NEXT DAS UBER SLINGSHOT? :damn:


Seriously Tho... When did enemy AA weaponry on merchant ships become so lethal and how come my AA isnt, when shooting at them? :down:

I know I read something in the manual about engaging warships on the surface and that all their weapons, AA included would be brought to bear on your sub but this is ridiculous.
I know in the past I have brought up the accuracy of your average merchant deck gun crew. But now I have to worry about every merchant ship??

What if they have a hunting rifle aboard? :o Mein Gott Noooo... Does this mean a few shots from a mauser or dbl bbl shotgun is gonna deep six my sub?

I have been rammed and DC'd and come out with as low as 5% total damage. But now.. some yin yang with an AA gun lets off a small burst and I have to scramble my repair crew to stop the 12% damage worth of flooding!!

Im flabberghatsed.... :doh:

Keep in mind that your boot needs to dive and no matter where a shell/bullet hits your hull it does dmg, while if you shoot the superstructure of a ship it wont damage it floating ability.

In anycase the damage model of sh3 is not perfect but i find it good enough.I was nearly sunk by a fire from a torpedo boot.

U-boats were not well known for their resistance to projectile weaponry, AA guns have even been used effectively against tanks in the past. 20mm HE AA rounds will work your sub over in a hurry. even "small" 50 caliber rounds will knock some sense into your u-boat.

even a destroyer - in real life - was obliterated by 50 caliber machine gun fire from a Tuskegee squadran P-47 when rounds penetrated the steel deck and ignited the ammo bunker within the ship causing it to explode violently.

can a ship equipped with 50 caliber or even 20 mm inflict moderate damage to a u-boat? the asnwer is an absolute and obvious yes. with enough 50 caliber rounds i could level my house - completely.

i submit the following:

this is a test of incidiary 50 caliber rounds against a 1/2 inch thick steel plate.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BsKfxXtQrzc

Under all circumstances ....... when in combat on the surface against
any weapon or delivery system keep maneuvering.:up:

Ummm, :doh: 20mm AP (that's armor piercing) May not make really big holes in armor but your boat is not armored, so the holes will be bigger, if someone unloads a 20 round magazine into your pressure hull you won't be able to dive until you get the holes fixed, and not only may they be hard to find, you might not be able to fix them. a 1 inch hole could sink your sub, easily. Not to mention permanent damage to secondary but vital systems like batteries.
These holes, even if fixed, should also make you very nervous about your boats ability to withstand water pressure, because patches aren't as good as the original hull.

I've never been a submariner, nor am I a naval engineer, but I've watched enough Discovery Channel to have second third and fourth thoughts about diving any depth with anything compromising my pressure hull.

IMO it should maybe be even worse to get hit by flak, a near miss bomb may rattle your boat, damage delicate systems, cause plates to buckle and possibly even shake loose an engine but it won't make a hole in the pressure hull.

I suggest reading the sections on this in the GWX manual, there's more detail

edit: dammit :stare: Mush and Goldenrivet beat me to it, and Rivet even found a movie I was going to go searching for now, oh well :D

20 MM hispano cannon - which existed in WW2.

nobody is going to convince me that this thing cant hurt a U-boat

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oc9E8_ZuESQ

Goldenrivet :o :o :o

umm, yep, there's your problem.... :rotfl:

If that doesn't convince I don't know what will....

I might be misremembering here, but the chances of a .50 caliber round causing a five-inch powder charge, which is in a brass cartridge, to explode is minimal. I think they actually penetrated the boilers, with much the same effect.

could have been, it was one or the other, i myself dont remember the exact cause of the detonation but i know the catalyst was a 50 cal round :lol:

Hi!

Dave Westwood's Anatomy of the Ship: Type VII U-boat gives the "armor" (aka pressure hull thickness) around the conning tower as 32mm, and the pressure hull itself as a maximum of 22mm. I have some wartime penetration data (somewhere :roll: ) that indicates the 20mm Hispano Suiza cannon firing AP Mk.II.S ammunition could penetrate 27mm of armor (perpendicular to the armor face) at a range of 200 yards. This weapon was carried primarily by aircraft (e.g., the P-38, Spitfire, Hurricane, Beaufighter, etc.

Ball ammunition (the type most likely to be carried) would only penetrate 12mm at most, but lots of little dings could add up to some serious damage if you're under a few hundred feet of water.

It seems to me that 20mm cannon fire would only rarely penetrate the pressure hull, but it could create weakpoints which could account for a 12% loss of hull integrity.

Pablo

One must also remember, that U-boat hulls are pressure hulls and NOT 'armored hulls.'

"After the war, German

Submarine Command records
revealed that

Oh yeah!:up: I recall reading that way back in the American Civil War one of the chief losses of river gunboats was a boiler hit. Everyone ended up abandoning ship.

Even if a WW2 destroyer doesn't sink, a high-pressure boiler filled with holes is not going to make for a happy crew.

GASP :o !!!

I am resigning my commission from the Kriegsmarine and Joining up with the LAH maybe I can grab a Tiger and not finish out the war riding around in a tube of toilet paper. :up:

But I do luv the technical info spewing forth as the result of my one sarcastic post.

A wealth of data.. Ahh bliss...

I figured Subs in general would be suseptible to almost any fire due to the fact that they submerge for a living but that doesnt make me any happeir that GWX takes that into account and Im no longer able to enagage as many surface targets.

You guys are consistently great! :rock:

Don't ask and ye shall receive more than you ever expected.. :D... :up: