Unknown Flag
 

On my last patrol I spotted a loan Coastal Merchant somwhere near BF81 and it was waving an unknown flag. A white circle on a red background (opposite to a Japanese flag). I couldn't ID it so I left it alone...

The nearest real world example I can find is Tunisia but theirs has a moon and star in the circle.

Any ideas? :hmm:

possibly the German flag, looks like this but without the swastika in the game:

http://www.hrtyrergalleries.com/images/444.jpg

I went searching the game files and found "german_m.tga"

http://www.ils2k.force9.co.uk/oddflag.jpg

This is flag I saw, but I'm sure the ship was indicated as an enemy?

That is the nazi flag - but due to legal reasons the devs decided to remove the swastika from the flag - thus you und up with the rad flag and white circle.

The one above is the Nazi german flag and the one you posted is the nazi flag with the swastika removed.

Thanks Scorpius... but I don't understand which legal reasons could prevent the devs from depicting the truth? Is this not a bit like pretending that Gremlins invaded Poland and not Germans? History is history... nuff said.

Couldnt agree more with you. But fact is fact, they removed it for possible legal reasons in germany. The swastika is illegal in germany and to have it in a game, regardless of whether it is about historical fact is not a good idea.

Put it in your signature and wait for the inevitable outrage from the forum community regarding. Its an unfortunate byproduct of the war over something which is rather cool in design.

The reason is that there is a single "European Release" throughout the European Union rather then individual releases for each country. In some states such as Germany, the Swastika is banned iconography, in other countries whilst it is legal - it makes sense to avoid causing inadvertent insult by using it for entertainment.

I for one live in a country where the use of a Swastika wouldn't be illegal, but choose not to mod the game. For one thing I don't see it as neccecery to enjoy the game and second, I have a lot of living relatives who survived the war (on both sides) and would rather not risk offending them.

I agree that when used inapropriately, the symbol can cause offence. Groups, people and organisations should be prevented from using the symbol to depict an ideology or point of view they share. But removing it from an historically based computer game is no different from "blurring" the symbol on a Discovery Channel documentary.

I think the offensive element comes from it's use... not the symbol itself. IMHO

Urrr no thanks :-?

You can always d/load the swastica mod and all German ships will have the swastika in the white circle.

I wasnt being serious. I actually did that on a sig which got forcibly removed and i got a warning.

But i agree wholeheartily. The insult is in its use, not the symbol itself. Read up on your history and you will find the symbol is a lot older. In fact iirc i think it was at one time used in a good way. Its a shame somthing as simple as a symbol can cause offence.

If you consider the Crusades a good thing Scorpius, sure...;)

Crusades? :doh:

I have a swastika on all my flags in the game. I wonder if that came with the NYGM Tonnage War mod or something. I know I never downloaded a specific swastika-fix.

And as for flags, the Kriegsmarine flag is the one shown above, the German civilian flag (the one flown by merchant vessels) is the red flag with a white circle and swastika (no black lines and no "iron cross" in the corner). Just like how the British civilians fly the red ensign but the Royal Navy has a different flag. Same thing. What you saw was a German merchant vessel.

more like moral/ethical reasons. Not like a nazi wil sue ubisoft for copyright.

No, entirely legal reasons. It's illegal to use the Nazi symbols in Germany. :hmm:

Basically they did it to avoid any possible repercussions.

By the way apologies if posting that symbol offended anyone, just for illustration and reference purposes only.

Actually, the swastika was originally an ancient Hindu religious symbol although it was also present in Native American traditions (apparently independantly)

I could be wrong, but I recall people like Rudyard Kipling and the Finnish royal family used it as their personal symbol until Nazism made it inappropriate.

Hi,

******** CONTROVERSIAL POST!! ********

Let's think about this for a sec. We are commanding German U-Boats in the game, sinking Allied boats (often our own nations boats in RL), all the in the name of Hitler and Nazi supremacy, yet people are upset at the Swastika being shown? Isn't this hypocritical?

If you are opposed to the Swastika being shown in-game for historical purposes, then surely you shouldn't be commanding a U-Boat either. :-? :hmm:

I'm English, I do understand the atrocities that occurred at the hands of the Nazis, and I do know that in Germany at least, it is illegal to posses/show/look at the Swastika in any context. I do understand why for our German neighbors that this would need to be removed.

That said, in my country it is not illegal, and for historically accurate purposes I'd like to add the missing parts of the flag back into the game (I have a tough time as it is with ID'ing ships without partial flags being thrown in!). Could someone please point me in the direction of this mod? I'm new to SH3 (I've had the game less than 2 weeks).

I know there are a couple of other countries in "Europe" (I use the quotes on purpose) where the Swasika is outlawed, but to suggest that ALL of "Europe" needs this flag removing is just wrong. IMHO, remove it where it is legally required, but make it an option (at install time or something) whether or not to show the full Nazi flag. This would keep everyone happy.

I do not mean any disrespect to anyone who was actually affected in RL by the events of WW2, but history is history. If it offends or upsets you, then I think you are in the wrong place.

Thankyou in advance.

--TangoShadow

I agree with some of what your saying there mate.