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-   -   WW2 Wasteful operations (https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=91495)

STEED 04-02-06 03:48 PM

WW2 Wasteful operations
 
My List as follows –

German, Kursk 43 and the Ardennes 44

British, Arnhem 44

American, Peleliu 44

Canada, Dieppe 42

Soviet, Seelow Heights 45

Western Allies, Cassino 44 (The first three)

Japan, Pearl Harbour 41

Bort 04-02-06 03:49 PM

Dieppe was almost certainly the most pointless, basically an insane massacre, that everyone knew would fail. :down:

Abraham 04-02-06 04:10 PM

WW2 Wasteful operations
 
I would add:

The Battle of El Alamein; as bloody as your average WW I battle and totally unnecessary since the Allies were landing one week later 1.500 miles in Rommels back near his logistic base (Operation TORCH). Whether the battle would be won or lost or fought at all, the result was the same: Rommel would have been forced to withdraw. The Allies knew this of course, but a 'pure' British victory in the disasterous year 1942 was a political necessety to strengthens Churchill's negotiating position at the Conference of Casablanca. (Roosevelt had the Battle of Midway!).

The six months clearing of an irrelevant and doomed German Army in Tunesia (Dec. 1942 till May 1943).

The invasion of Sicily without blocking the German retreat route over the street of Messina (could otherwise have been a solid victory).

The invasion of Italy (Salerno) instead of France in 1943.

The attack on the Hürtgen Woods in Jan. 1945.

Actually the list is almost endless, but in my opinion the decision to knock Italy out of the war in 1943 instead of making France participate in 1943 is the worst.

STEED 04-02-06 04:13 PM

Re: WW2 Wasteful operations
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Abraham
The attack on the Hürtgen Woods in Jan. 1945.

Yes that has my vote nearly forgot that one.

TLAM Strike 04-02-06 04:16 PM

Japan: Operation Ten-Go

Abraham 04-02-06 04:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TLAM Strike
Japan: Operation Ten-Go

Ten go?
Which means in normal English? :D

Torplexed 04-02-06 04:24 PM

Ten-Go was the Yamato's final, fatal sortie towards the US landings on Okinawa.

TLAM Strike 04-02-06 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abraham
Quote:

Originally Posted by TLAM Strike
Japan: Operation Ten-Go

Ten go?
Which means in normal English? :D

One word (albeit a Japanese word)
Yamato

Edit; Beat me to it Torpelexed :D

Torplexed 04-02-06 04:44 PM

My addition to the list would be the Japanese invasion of eastern India in 1944 and the battles of Kohima and Imphal. Might have been fruitful in drawing away Allied troops from other fronts in 1942...but by '44 what was the point?

Kapitan 04-02-06 04:46 PM

the two wars them selves.

TLAM Strike 04-02-06 05:26 PM

Another PTO battle.

The Japanese Invason of Kiska and Attu.

Kapitan 04-02-06 05:27 PM

American day bombing in germany.

AG124 04-02-06 05:29 PM

I read a book once that seriously suggested that the Germans would have benefited from sacrificing the Scharnhorst and Gneisneau to take over some of the Caribbean islands (don't remember the specifics). The author really couldn't understand why the idea was never thought of in WWII. :roll:

Kapitan 04-02-06 05:30 PM

If the germans had done that then they could have based FW200 condors and other long range bombers there and bombed the east coast.

STEED 04-02-06 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xrvjorn
Quote:

Originally Posted by Kapitain
American day bombing in germany.

But wasn't the targeting of specific industries, like ball bearing plants, a success?

Yes at a high price.

Kapitan 04-02-06 05:34 PM

Could have done the same job at night as the RAF did.
would have saved alot of men

TLAM Strike 04-02-06 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kapitain
Could have done the same job at night as the RAF did.
would have saved alot of men

Not necessarily remember the Luftwaffe’s air defenses were all geared towards night attackers. When the USAAF began daylight bombing all the Luftwaffe’s Bf109s and Fw190s that were needed for offensive operations (Guarding the bombers and CAS aircraft) were suddenly relegated to defending Berlin. So no they could not have bottled up the Luftwaffe’s daylight fighters with nighttime raids.

Quote:

If the germans had done that then they could have based FW200 condors and other long range bombers there and bombed the east coast.
Don't forget their was a large USN force based on the east coast just for something like this (centered around the USS Wasp CV-7 and several Battleships) I think that any Caribbean Island invaded would have been subject to massive USAAF and USN attack from Carrier planes and land based bombers followed by the USMC.

Kapitan 04-02-06 05:52 PM

More than likely but the germans showed that blitzkrieg can destroy a country in mere weeks even the french lost within weeks.

So what chance has a few battle ships a tinpot carrier a hand ful of planes and marines going to do ?

by the time they re group germany could re fortify that island sending uboat convoys to defend it and supply it.

TLAM Strike 04-02-06 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kapitain
So what chance has a few battle ships a tinpot carrier a hand ful of planes and marines going to do ?

A couple of Tinpot Carriers and a hand full Marines held midway! I bet the German Marines (did they even have them) or more likely the German Army never experienced a pounding like the Japanese experienced on some of their island fortresses. The Caribbean is in such a range that US land based bombers could come off the factory lines, get fueled up and bomb them, the Germans have basically nothing to counter them no Fighters with adequate ferry range, no carriers to deliver them, any freighter delivering them would be subject to US submarine and air attack, so no air cover of the island. In other words any Fw-200 bombers would be there undefended.

Quote:

by the time they re group germany could re fortify that island sending uboat convoys to defend it and supply it.
Then less U-Boats to attack North Atlantic Convoys, also the USN has its own submarines from the East Coast and from the Panama Canal to conduct ASW (yes US Subs did ASW patrols in the Atlantic) around any German island base to cut off supplies.

Torplexed 04-02-06 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TLAM Strike
Another PTO battle.

The Japanese Invason of Kiska and Attu.

I agree. Another wasteful battle was the US-Canadian operation to take 'em back. ;)


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