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An added 100HP sounds like a reasonable value. As soon as you can release another beta version, I'll help test it! :up:
ya, I think people are misunderstanding the hollywood name. In fact, this mod has nothing to do with hollywood... :roll: |
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Beacause I aim to play RUB and HT together I want a semi realistic side of the game however there are some things I will change myself i.e. deck gun times. With regards to the name I will leave that to Jungman to decide. Maybe people can think of a good all round name that will make people want to try. I am sure word of mouth will gather on this mod thats why I want to be patient and make sure we have done the best one available. He may just want to produce a mass .zon pack that tweaks all damage setting and leave the rest to individual modders to alter their mods to include. maybe the best option. Now that crew deficiency is close to being sussed without altering fatigue models i.e. simple changes in basic and zones.cfg files. Each major mod group should really adapt their fatigue models to accept the changes. As for me, I still want to try and get a 24 hour system up and running. I also love the disabled crew buttons as it really effects my gameplay when I forget to man the torpedo stations for reloading asap. I am going to wait for the .zon files before tweaking the damage again. In the meantime I think all us beta testers should concentrate o the crew aspects of the mod. We need to discover the best settings so that crew become a pleasure rather than a click and forget. I know there is a mathmatical calculation between coef and compartments. We need to discover this formula and know what changes what. At this moment it is a matter of number crunching i.e. timing the model in campaighn. I have altered the crew basic as follows please chack to see if any mistakes or discepancies are obvious. [CREW_0] ;SEAMAN MoraleMin=0.30 MoraleMax=0.60 MoraleStep=0.05 FatigueMin=0 FatigueMax=0.95 FatigueStep=0.1 CoefMorale=0.4 CoefFatigue=0.1 QualEffect=1 Hp=10 Wounded=-0.02 Dead=-0.05 SunkShips=0.1 TorpedoHit=0.05 Experience=0 [CREW_1] ;ABLESEAMAN MoraleMin=0.30 MoraleMax=0.60 MoraleStep=0.05 FatigueMin=0 FatigueMax=0.90 FatigueStep=0.1 CoefMorale=0.4 CoefFatigue=0.1 QualEffect=1.5 Hp=11 Wounded=-0.02 Dead=-0.05 SunkShips=0.1 TorpedoHit=0.05 Experience=10 [CREW_2] ;LEADINGSEAMAN MoraleMin=0.30 MoraleMax=0.60 MoraleStep=0.05 FatigueMin=0 FatigueMax=0.85 FatigueStep=0.1 CoefMorale=0.4 CoefFatigue=0.1 QualEffect=2 Hp=12 Wounded=-0.02 Dead=-0.05 SunkShips=0.1 TorpedoHit=0.05 Experience=30 [CREW_3] ;PETTYOFFICER MoraleMin=0.40 MoraleMax=0.70 MoraleStep=0.05 FatigueMin=0 FatigueMax=0.80 FatigueStep=0.1 CoefMorale=0.3 CoefFatigue=0.1 QualEffect=2.5 Hp=13 Wounded=-0.02 Dead=-0.05 SunkShips=0.1 TorpedoHit=0.05 Experience=50 [CREW_4] ;CHIEFPETTYOFFICER MoraleMin=0.40 MoraleMax=0.70 MoraleStep=0.05 FatigueMin=0 FatigueMax=0.75 FatigueStep=0.1 CoefMorale=0.3 CoefFatigue=0.1 QualEffect=3 Hp=14 Wounded=-0.02 Dead=-0.05 SunkShips=0.1 TorpedoHit=0.05 Experience=100 [CREW_5] ;CHIEFBOATSWAIN MoraleMin=0.40 MoraleMax=0.70 MoraleStep=0.05 FatigueMin=0 FatigueMax=0.70 FatigueStep=0.1 CoefMorale=0.3 CoefFatigue=0.1 QualEffect=3.5 Hp=15 Wounded=-0.02 Dead=-0.05 SunkShips=0.1 TorpedoHit=0.05 Experience=150 [CREW_6] ;SUBLIEUTENANT MoraleMin=0.50 MoraleMax=0.80 MoraleStep=0.1 FatigueMin=0 FatigueMax=0.65 FatigueStep=0.1 CoefMorale=0.2 CoefFatigue=0.1 QualEffect=3.8 Hp=16 Wounded=-0.02 Dead=-0.05 SunkShips=0.1 TorpedoHit=0.05 Experience=200 [CREW_7] ;LIEUTENANTJR MoraleMin=0.50 MoraleMax=0.80 MoraleStep=0.1 FatigueMin=0 FatigueMax=0.60 FatigueStep=0.1 CoefMorale=0.2 CoefFatigue=0.1 QualEffect=4.3 Hp=17 Wounded=-0.02 Dead=-0.05 SunkShips=0.1 TorpedoHit=0.05 Experience=250 [CREW_8] ;LIEUTENANTSR MoraleMin=0.50 MoraleMax=0.80 MoraleStep=0.1 FatigueMin=0 FatigueMax=0.55 FatigueStep=0.1 CoefMorale=0.2 CoefFatigue=0.1 QualEffect=4.5 Hp=18 Wounded=-0.02 Dead=-0.05 SunkShips=0.1 TorpedoHit=0.05 Experience=300 [COMPARTMENT] NumberOfCrew0=15 Interval1_0=7.1 Interval2_0=9.6 Interval3_0=19.7 NumberOfCrew1=6 Interval1_1=3.0 Interval2_1=4.1 Interval3_1=8.5 NumberOfCrew2=9 Interval1_2=4.6 Interval2_2=6 Interval3_2=12.1 NumberOfCrew3=12 Interval1_3=6.1 Interval2_3=7.8 Interval3_3=16 NumberOfCrew4=8 Interval1_4=4.1 Interval2_4=5.3 Interval3_4=11 NumberOfCrew5=10 Interval1_5=60 Interval2_5=60 Interval3_5=60 NumberOfCrew6=7 Interval1_6=3.7 Interval2_6=4.7 Interval3_6=9.7 NumberOfCrew7=5 Interval1_7=2.7 Interval2_7=3.5 Interval3_7=7.3 NumberOfCrew8=3 Interval1_8=1.6 Interval2_8=2.3 Interval3_8=4.65 NumberOfCrew9=4 Interval1_9=2.2 Interval2_9=2.9 Interval3_9=6.1 NumberOfCrew10=14 Interval1_10=6.5 Interval2_10=8.2 Interval3_10=14.3 NumberOfCrew11=2 Interval1_11=1.1 Interval2_11=1.7 Interval3_11=4.1 NumberOfCrew12=1 Interval1_12=0.5 Interval2_12=0.7 Interval3_12=1.1 Also look at Coef levels though I am now suspecting morale may be tied to Morale but may be wron it might in fact be that morale is tied to the compartment workrates. All this need looking at for patterns feel free to add changes to your games and testing them. [FATIGUE_COEF] ;comp 0 RegularFactor00=0.004 SpecificFactor00=0.003 BadWeather0=0.003 ;comp1 RegularFactor10=0.1 RegularFactor11=0.1 SpecificFactor10=0.004 SpecificFactor11=0.002 BadWeather1=0.0002 ;comp2 RegularFactor20=0.1 RegularFactor21=0.1 SpecificFactor20=0.004 SpecificFactor21=0.001 BadWeather2=0.0003 ;comp3 RegularFactor30=0.05 RegularFactor31=0.001 SpecificFactor30=0.004 SpecificFactor31=0.0 BadWeather3=0.01 ;comp4 RegularFactor40=0.001 RegularFactor41=0.05 SpecificFactor40=0.0 SpecificFactor41=0.004 BadWeather4=0.00000001 ;comp5 RegularFactor50=0.1 RegularFactor51=0.1 SpecificFactor50=0.01 SpecificFactor51=0.01 BadWeather5=0.2 ;comp6 RegularFactor60=-0.01 RegularFactor61=-0.02 SpecificFactor60=-0.009 SpecificFactor61=-0.013 ;comp7 RegularFactor70=0.10 RegularFactor71=0.10 SpecificFactor70=-0.015 SpecificFactor71=-0.028 ;comp8 RegularFactor80=0.1 RegularFactor81=0.1 SpecificFactor80=0.01 SpecificFactor81=0.01 BadWeather8=0.2 ;comp9 RegularFactor90=0.10 SpecificFactor90=0.03 BadWeather9=0.5 ;comp10 RegularFactor100=0.15 SpecificFactor100=0.03 BadWeather10=0.5 ;comp 11 RegularFactor110=0.01 RegularFactor111=0.01 SpecificFactor110=0.0001 SpecificFactor111=0.0001 BadWeather11=0 Happy Tweaking |
Thanks for all the accolades. :D I am glad I stumbled across that along time ago. never knew what it was about.
A name? Maybe simple. Damage Repair Mod; Repair Damage Mod; Slow Death Mod; Damage Mod; Repair Mod; somthing that is simple and to the point. People will look for those words when scanning years from now through tons of mods wondering what they do by their name. What exactly do you want me to change in the sub zone files exactly? You have the most obvious Health Points and Armor level. I asume leave armor alone. Increase HP by same amount for all, or a percent change? I like the better qualification progression; are you still keeping the Cohesion effects for each comparment or is this being revamped? Here is the values for HP and Armor for each submarine modeled. Type, Health, Armor, Crash_depth IIA: 150, 22, 214 IID: 150, 22, 221 VIIB: 250, 25, 315 VIIC: 250, 25, 346 IXB: 300, 25, 303 IXC: 300, 25, 325 IXD2: 320, 25, 330 XXI: 450, 28, 400 So exactly what values do you wish for me to change? :hmm: I would start with the HP only. You can get a feel of the effects by looking at the diferent boat HP. |
If it were up to me, I'd try:
Type, health, armor IIA: 200, 22 IID: 200, 22 VIIB: 350, 25 VIIC: 350, 25 IXB: 400, 25 IXC: 400, 25 IXD2: 420, 25 XXI: 480, 28 And maybe leave the crash depths unaltered. I don't imagine these values would give us too many consequences. Even if someone were crazy enough to try and ram a DD on the surface, he'd probably get sunk before he could get close enough to try it. The flood modelling would take care of that... Well, let's wait and see what gouldjg wants... :sunny: |
If you need a Zones.cfg
Ive made a new "Hollywood" kind mod by my self, but with the goal of realism, not hollywood ;) i guess ive modified everything in this config. its still beta but the german community likes it so far and it adds a bit more realism to sh3. all the systems getting more damage by now. the diesels, the periscopes, the pump, everything... if you want to use it with this mod or better "Breakthrough" feel free, it maybe saves work for you guys? http://dl5.rapidshare.de/files/63697...7634/Zones.rar |
Thanks, I will check it out. I am too going for realism with a flair. The changes made have this effect.
There is more chance for systems to get destroyed, have more causalties and wounded. Much more flooding. And much longer repairs. You can die by sinking past crush death from the hull giving in, but check this out, it took me almost three long minutes of the drawn out death screen where my lights flicker on/off, steam pipes start to blow, water flood, noise all over. Instead of dying in a few seconds, It took a few minutes for me to die. Very entertaining. :P I still get killed quick on the surface, one hit by a DD took 20% hull off. An airplane bomb took 50% hull. DC charges are just as deadly, if they hit close to you, dead is dead. A DC has enough damage to overkill you anyway to make up for the extra Health Points I added to the Submarines.zon file. I had once were I sunk to the ocean bottom 109m. The DD left the scene from after two DC hits. I had to spend almost an HOUR real time trying to fix the flooding, take care the wounded, move the dead crew. I had most systems destroyed or damaged severely, I had to use all my ballast and one electric engine left to get to the surface. I was in no shape to fight war anymore so I sail home. I lost half my fuel anyway. Almost ran out of air. Then a surprise airplane two hours later caught me on surface, :o I could not dive, a DD showed up after playing dodge the bomb and got hit, started sinking anyway from flooding, I was in a VIIB my hull at 48% once I went past somewhere past 100 meters the lights start to flicker, half my crew already died earlier so not enough people to pump the flood water out. I sank down more trying to go forward to keep the sub up....then water pipes exploded inside the command room, noise screaming (tied into the wav files for sound effects), I hit 230m after about 2.5 minutes once past 100m taking pressure damage. At 230m I finially died. :hulk: So you see this is a working model that extends the death sequence by a few minutes and more, you got some time to get back up to the top, if not you die slow and painfully. :arrgh!: I think we could call this version the Die Hard Mod for the movie with Bruce Willis in it. :rotfl: That was a 'Hollywood' movie. This is much more fun to play now. :yep: I did make changes to some crew concepts from gouldjd to fit my idea. It is really minor stuff, it is when the combat start is where it shines. I made the 'fatigue' system more simple somewhat. |
Die Hard Mod
Neverminding that it is also a 'hollywood' movie, that is one of the catchiest titles I have ever come across... Shoot, gouldjg... Jungman has not only helped to perfect your system, but he has also managed to sell it! :lol: :up: |
Good Morning guys
Jungman That story is cool and that is what players wanted all along. I supect we could at least suvive one direct run into path of DC and although critical we get to watch the men die and flooding for a while. I say go with it. By the way what level did you st the hp for that test. Was is 100 or by 50. Die Hard is a cool name, Zones cfg will need a major tweak to simulate the changes and put more work on repairs. I want some things set that cannot be repaired after a severe bashing. I can do this quite fast when the .zon files are done for each sub. what do you think about the casualty rate.? did it seem good or do the men now need slightly higher HP to get more injuries and less deaths. Intervals could maybe be slightly tweaked so that qualification and rank play a bigger part in the game. Show me your changes in that department. In the mean time I am going to do some timing on the fatigue rates on normal cruise and by following a convoy to see if there are major differences. I will also test some weather effects. This is starting to become ready for a release version once we all come to some form of aggreement on each change. I have posted my tweaks from last night, we need to decide what to go with and what to change. I will speak later after work or use work pc to discus further. Well done guys I would start collecting some of your best sceenies to use for the release thread. Also any tips for play etc. I need to write up the compartment guides to go on crew screen. (a good way as a readme in game :lol: ) Time to start putting it all together. :up: |
How about the (UN-Believably Improved Real Hollywood Damage Mod. 1.44b Version 1a).
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P.S. the title of this thread should be changed so that 'HOLLYWOOD' doesn't scare people off... :lol: |
What about the name Gouldmarhjung Mod
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I can't wait for the first gold release of this. I love the hollywood damage at the mo, so i can#t imagine how great this is going to be! But can i ask a small question.
Will it work with the German version, or will the thing like 'Captain motivation room' still be written in English? As i say, only a small thing, but am just wondering, as i play in German...obviously! :lol: Thanks again for this great work!! :arrgh!: |
Just as a constructive feed back......
Not all users enjoy the fatigue management, personally become tired of it and had eliminated it, i am not a nurse, my crew must to know when to sleep or not, specially in time compresion. As a sugestion..... is better if you build the "damage" and the "fatigue" modification separatelly and as optionals. Many thanks for your effort. Best regards, Red. |
The test I used was a joke at first setting HP from 250 to 2500. But maybe it was not. Dead is dead. A direct hit 10m by a DC still will kill you. I would rather have half my crew dead than instant 'game over' screen.
A direct DC hit that takes all the health points from a compartment still kills off the main Uboat even if you have 95% hull. A DC direct hit will inflict enough damage to blow off a Stern Comparments basic HP in Zones.cfg. This is subtracted from the parent main Hull HP, but if that compartment is destroyed (say 100HP), the Uboat is gone too. Out of two DC close hits 15m to 20m (not direct hits), many systems down or destroyed, one main officer dead, four crewman wounded, and nine crewman dead. I sank to the ocean botom lucky it was only 109m deep. Took forever to get the flooding under control and fix everything. Barely made it back to the top alive to limp home. The game applies damage in a dice roll similiar to the Star Trek StarFleet Battles. it goes to systems or the hull. After that hit my hull was at 95%. But so what, in real life it was not the hull that killed the Uboat crew, it was losing vital systems and flooding then sinking to crush depth that killed you. So who cares about super high HP for the hull, it makes the death scene, especially for crush death, take a few minutes (instead of two seconds) while light go out, pipes break, steam noise, etc. You are still going to die unless you blow ballast and try hard to surface. On the surface, I got hit by a DD shell, it took 20% hull straight off, a second hit killed two more crewmen and another system, but no hull damage. An Airplane bomb hit close by and stripped it down to 48% hull. So what I am saying, the higher HP hulls realy do not protect you from dying because of the lower armor values in Zones.cfg. It balances out. Instead of the instant death screen, you get a very crippled ship with many wounded and dead, lucky to make it home to port, or enjoy a rather pleasant death scene sinking to crush depth or sitting on ocean floor waiting for another DD attack or running out of air. I kind of chucked out the cohesion thing. I went to a more plain logical stress system. Call one the Mess Hall. Your men simply lose energy faster being in stressful stations such as torpedo room or assigned to the damage control team. They simply rest in the quarters, one is faster than the other. I found that having my bow quarters full would cause my watch crew to move into the bow torpedo upon diving too much and it got repeatative. Cohesion is/was a good system for keeping you from moving the crew around too much, but I find using the changes to intervals, qualification, and hull HP makes this a moot point. I also changes the Officers to have less a fatigue step, they take much longer to tire but long to recuperate. There are two beds and five officers, I could not stand micromanaging all of it. Then the petty officers are in between the officers and regular seaman for fatigue step. This is similiar to the original stock game. I also see that as the crew gains rank and medals, then you get closer to a boat that can get 100% efficiency in a station. if you start with a green newbies, you will have much less. I think this makes rank and medals more important, and a good reason to spend renown on a skilled crew. SO what I am saying is I like to finish what you want done for your Hollywood Mod, but I would like to make a version that is different in crew management, more simple and logical intuitive. Placing a man in one department and switching him will not be that bad, which is a fundamental change from your model. Now there is enough room in the universe for several models. Even Kaa and Berry have their own. Even the German forum is using something similiar. So I can finish up with hex editing a model for your Hollywood mod as it is with Cohesion idea. I am sorry mate, but I pefer using the new stuff discovered to the fullest extent and it seems to make it simpler at the same time very entertaining. The whole point was there was no way to stop the fast hull bleed. Now that is solved. Before it was nerfing the hell out of the armor and crew to make them less effecient. Now that is not neccessary. I theory it seems cool, but in practice it is rather pointless and confusing. I really do not know what to think. I would like to finish a version for your Holywood Mod. I would like to make a more 'simple' version for me called the Die hard Mod. based upon your work, and you will have plenty of credit for its birth of an idea. Maybe both would be good depending upon how one wants to play the game. What do yoiu think? Chuck out the Cohesion stuff and go for the more simple intuitive model in light of the new discoveries? Or make two versions, one with Cohesion idea, the other with more Traditional gameplay? I do not want to make you upset. That is what I meant calling this subset simplier version Die Hard Mod. Not that I meant to call the original Hollywood Mod that since I made rather big fundemental changes to the original idea, mainly back to basic gameplay with the new discoveries, no need for fancy crew assignments anymore as far as I am concerned. In the version you have now, you would not want to go with such a huge increase in hull HP. In this variation I am using it is a must; and all the sub systems and armor levels, and crew may have be adjusted rather drastically. It effectively makes the long death screen a reality, my personal objetive all along. Do you want to go back to the more traditional crew model in light of the discoveries? or continue and make two versions? One you like, and one for me that is 'simplier'? I can do both at once. :hmm: Sometimes new things come up, and changes are in order. Just because someone can do something does not mean they should do something. You are correct about the Regular and Specific factors upon placing a man in a station. But I find it now redundant. :-? |
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This is in light of new discoveries. I can tell you, it will breath new life back into the game without losing reality. :P But I do not want to upset gouldjg. :( Making fundamental changes back to original. |
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