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-   -   [REL] "New" old unit: Queen Mary ocean liner \ troop transport (Reworked 2017 edition) (https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=233268)

Kendras 10-07-17 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gap (Post 2517399)
But you can remove the halo effects, or make them smaller, don't you? If navigation light's halos were that big in reality, it wouldn't be possible to screen them off at certain angles :yep:

Yes, but the halo will disappear at medium distance, so you won't be able to spot it from your submarine... :doh:

Quote:

Originally Posted by gap (Post 2517399)
Did you assign different materials to each copy of the original lantern, before combining them in a single object?

No, for 2 reasons : 1/ i can't do that, 2/ if i assign 2 different materials to the object in S3D, they should be both used ? ...

Quote:

Originally Posted by gap (Post 2517399)
Make sure that S3d, in the Uv map previe section, diplays two map channels for the recently imported object.

Yes, it does.

Quote:

Originally Posted by gap (Post 2517399)
Also make sure that you didn't accidentally switch the two matirials: their position matters.

It was the correct order.

gap 10-07-17 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kendras (Post 2517412)
Yes, but the halo will disappear at medium distance, so you won't be able to spot it from your submarine... :doh:

Well, I think it is a matter of finding the right size for an aptimal balance between light arcs and their visible range. By the way, those are the interantional rules on light visibility:

http://navruleshandbook.com/Rule22.html

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kendras (Post 2517412)
No, for 2 reasons : 1/ i can't do that, 2/ if i assign 2 different materials to the object in S3D, they should be both used ? ...

That's the likely reason for your night lights not working. Stop asking yourself impertinent questions (lol) and strictly follow my instructions :O:

Quote:

Originally Posted by gap (Post 2517357)
  1. Select one of the two objects in body selection mode.
  2. Switch to face selection mode.
  3. Right click on the geometry window.
  4. Right click on 'Material' in the following context menu.
  5. Enter the new material name.
  6. Undo the selection (space bar).
  7. Repeat the steps 1-5 for the other copy of the same object, using a different material name.
  8. When you have finished, select both objects in body selection mode.
  9. Right click on the geometry window.
  10. Choose 'Combine' from the context menu.

PS: If S3D asks you whether you want to import one of the subsets separately, or raather collapse collapse the two of them in one object, choose the latter option :03:

VonDos 10-08-17 12:32 AM

Hi mates!
While waiting for this gorgeous lights work, i'm reworking a little some details.
Here are first funnel horns pipes (2 with Y shape, not 2 vertical):

http://www.sterling.rmplc.co.uk/visions/funnel2.jpg
https://image.ibb.co/kzRZtw/SH3_Img_..._11_58_395.png
Best regards,
Vd

Kendras 10-08-17 04:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VonDos (Post 2517468)
Hi mates!
While waiting for this gorgeous lights work, i'm reworking a little some details.
Here are first funnel horns pipes (2 with Y shape, not 2 vertical)

I always wanted to add working hornpipes to ships ! Do you think about a trigger that could be used to launch the visual and sound effect ? :hmmm:

Someone had the good idea to launch the effect when the rudder was turning, but how can you link rudder's position to the effect ? :hmmm:

Kendras 10-08-17 05:05 AM

So, in wings, I have duplicated the material and changed its name.

Now in game, the lantern is bright green during night :up:, but it is white during day :-? ...

VonDos 10-08-17 05:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kendras (Post 2517480)
I always wanted to add working hornpipes to ships ! Do you think about a trigger that could be used to launch the visual and sound effect ? :hmmm:

Someone had the good idea to launch the effect when the rudder was turning, but how can you link rudder's position to the effect ? :hmmm:

I honestly don't know this, but should be gorgeous!
Btw, voilą a "definitive" version:

https://image.ibb.co/npWWQb/SH3_Img_..._26_52_695.jpg

Best regards,
Vd

Kendras 10-08-17 06:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VonDos (Post 2517487)
Btw, voilą a "definitive" version

Very nice ! :up:

@gap : I don't manage to make the light city work properly. So, I send you the files : there is a single mission ("QM") which starts before night, so you can use Time Compression and see difference between day and night.

https://www.mediafire.com/file/3jctm...-%20QM%20v1.7z

Anvar1061 10-08-17 06:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kendras (Post 2517494)
Very nice ! :up:

@gap : I don't manage to make the light city work properly. So, I send you the files : there is a single mission ("QM") which starts before night, so you can use Time Compression and see difference between day and night.

https://www.mediafire.com/file/3jctm...-%20QM%20v1.7z

https://pp.userapi.com/c639727/v6397...LGtxvgdsyI.jpg
What do these "nlusM" files mean?

Kendras 10-08-17 09:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anvar1061 (Post 2517502)

Oh, I forgot to delete them...

Anvar1061 10-08-17 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kendras (Post 2517552)
Oh, I forgot to delete them...

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/imag...aleun_Rolf.gif

Kendras 10-09-17 04:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kendras (Post 2517494)
Very nice ! :up:

@gap : I don't manage to make the light city work properly. So, I send you the files : there is a single mission ("QM") which starts before night, so you can use Time Compression and see difference between day and night.

https://www.mediafire.com/file/3jctm...-%20QM%20v1.7z

Check the lateral lanterns (green and red) models, and try to find what's wrong . :D

gap 10-09-17 04:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kendras (Post 2517552)
Oh, I forgot to delete them...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kendras (Post 2517669)
Check the lateral lanterns (green and red) models, and try to find what's wrong . :D

I have tried to fix them, but still no joy. By the way: I have placed one of the stock houses on top of the Queen Mary (through placement node), Its windows are lit up at night, so the idea is still valid: we just need to discover what is wrong with our implementation of it :hmm2:

VonDos 10-09-17 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gap (Post 2517757)
I have tried to fix them, but still no joy. By the way: I have placed one of the stock houses on top of the Queen Mary (through placement node), Its windows are lit up at night, so the idea is still valid: we just need to discover what is wrong with our implementation of it :hmm2:

Hi!
Maybe you can clone the house object, re-model him like portholes (with same materials but different textures?) creating a new library object... so we will maybe have enlighted nightime portholes like a library part we can link as equipment in timeline...

Best regards,
Vd

gap 10-09-17 05:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VonDos (Post 2517760)
Hi!
Maybe you can clone the house object, re-model him like portholes (with same materials but different textures?)

That's exactly the point: I can change names, textures, etc, but when I replace the stock house model with a similar mesh, the light effect becomes broken. :hmmm:

I must be doing something wrong. Still investigating :salute:

VonDos 10-10-17 08:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kendras (Post 2517480)
I always wanted to add working hornpipes to ships ! Do you think about a trigger that could be used to launch the visual and sound effect ? :hmmm:

Someone had the good idea to launch the effect when the rudder was turning, but how can you link rudder's position to the effect ? :hmmm:

Hi!
Small alternative idea!
Why don't create a new sound for queen mary only, adding a "Ship.Queen.Mary._mix" after "Ship.Passenger Ship._mix" into data->sound-> sh3.sdl? In my idea this definition should link to a new file (Queen Mary_mix, in sh3->sound directory) that should include original Passenger Ship_mix trace repeated for 10 minutes. After 8 minutes (for example, or when you want) QM's hornpipes' sound should be added to this trace.
After that, from NPPQ_.dsd, index 13 soundsource should be changed to "Ship.Queen.Mary._mix", and every 10 minutes we should be able to hear the horns' sound.
Is this possible?
Is this stupid?

Best regards,
Vd

gap 10-10-17 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kendras (Post 2517480)
I always wanted to add working hornpipes to ships ! Do you think about a trigger that could be used to launch the visual and sound effect ? :hmmm:

Someone had the good idea to launch the effect when the rudder was turning, but how can you link rudder's position to the effect ? :hmmm:

I think the rudder-triggered horn was just a never realized idea. :hmmm:

What is surely possible. is doing a ship to send horn/siren distress signals when she spots an enemy (through a virtual gun muzzle flash effect) and/or when she is damaged (through damage box effects) :yep:
Quote:

Originally Posted by VonDos (Post 2517811)
Hi!
Small alternative idea!
Why don't create a new sound for queen mary only, adding a "Ship.Queen.Mary._mix" after "Ship.Passenger Ship._mix" into data->sound-> sh3.sdl? In my idea this definition should link to a new file (Queen Mary_mix, in sh3->sound directory) that should include original Passenger Ship_mix trace repeated for 10 minutes. After 8 minutes (for example, or when you want) QM's hornpipes' sound should be added to this trace.
After that, from NPPQ_.dsd, index 13 soundsource should be changed to "Ship.Queen.Mary._mix", and every 10 minutes we should be able to hear the horns' sound.
Is this possible?
Is this stupid?

Not stupid, but I would find the same sound looping every 10 minutes quite depressing and a bit unrealistic. After all, due to their speed, the Queen Mary and her sister ship the Queen Elizabeth were often travelling out of convoy and without escort screen. Why should they use so often their horns while sailing on a straight line, in the middle of the ocean and with no other ships around, if not for casting the attenction of any passing by attacker? :O:

P.S: I have finally managed getting night lights to work properly!
More on them later :yeah:

Kendras 10-11-17 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gap (Post 2517861)
INot stupid, but I would find the same sound looping every 10 minutes quite depressing and a bit unrealistic. After all, due to their speed, the Queen Mary and her sister ship the Queen Elizabeth were often travelling out of convoy and without escort screen. Why should they use so often their horns while sailing on a straight line, in the middle of the ocean and with no other ships around, if not for casting the attenction of any passing by attacker? :O:

And also you won't hear the horn, because you stop hearing ship's sound from only a few km ...

Quote:

Originally Posted by gap (Post 2517861)
P.S: I have finally managed getting night lights to work properly! More on them later :yeah:

Good news ! Without drawbacks ? :O:

gap 10-12-17 01:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kendras (Post 2518080)
And also you won't hear the horn, because you stop hearing ship's sound from only a few km ...

Well, if the sound was set appropriately, it could be heard as far as the game 3D rendering radius :yep:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kendras (Post 2518080)
Good news ! Without drawbacks ? :O:

Yes and no. For textures not requiring an opacity mask, it works like a charm. I couldn't manage setting the effect to work with alpha channels though.
As for the specular map of the La Plate lighthouse, grey tones in the alpha channel are readeither as black (fully trensparent) or white (fully opaque), thus killing the smooth transition effect of light halos.

There must be somewhere in SHIII materials/textures maps, a flag not known to Skwas while he was working on S3d, that tells the game wether to use alpha channels as B/W (1 bit) bitmaps, or as greyscale (8 bit) images. As I said in one of my previous posts, S3d can read/write these unknown adress(es), but it doesn't display them among the other parameters and properties available for editing. The workaround I used for the specular mask, was replacing the old material with one copied from a stock file, where it was used for a similar purpose. Unfortunately, I couldn't find so far a texture map chunk connected with a greyscale alpha channel. That means that I need to discover where is the flag that I need to change, and tweak using an hex editor :doh:

Kendras 10-12-17 03:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gap (Post 2518160)
Well, if the sound was set appropriately, it could be heard as far as the game 3D rendering radius :yep:

Not if the horn's sound is read on the ship's sound, else you will hear the ship's sound from 30 km ! So, the horn's sound must be separated from the ship's sound.

Quote:

Originally Posted by gap (Post 2518160)
For textures not requiring an opacity mask, it works like a charm. I couldn't manage setting the effect to work with alpha channels though. The workaround I used for the specular mask, was replacing the old material with one copied from a stock file, where it was used for a similar purpose.

I see, same solution as for La Plate texture (the tower was black) ! :up:

Quote:

Originally Posted by gap (Post 2518160)
As for the specular map of the La Plate lighthouse, grey tones in the alpha channel are readeither as black (fully trensparent) or white (fully opaque), thus killing the smooth transition effect of light halos.

So, we couldn't switch on/off our lighthouses' light halo depending on day/night period ? :wah:

Quote:

Originally Posted by gap (Post 2518160)
Unfortunately, I couldn't find so far a texture map chunk connected with a greyscale alpha channel. That means that I need to discover where is the flag that I need to change, and tweak using an hex editor :doh:

Wow, you know how to use these things ? Else, ask Jeff Grooves. :yep:

gap 10-12-17 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kendras (Post 2518168)
Not if the horn's sound is read on the ship's sound, else you will hear the ship's sound from 30 km ! So, the horn's sound must be separated from the ship's sound.

Okay :up:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kendras (Post 2518168)
I see, same solution as for La Plate texture (the tower was black) ! :up:

Yep, unfortunately it doesn't apply in this case, because among stock files I couldn't find any example of a "texture map" (type 13/0) controller with an embedded opacity mask. The latter type of controller got the usual "Disable z-buffer + enable alpha blend" checkbox though (its name is S3d is actually misleading: it should be rather called "enable alpha test"), so I suspect that also the hidden (and actual) alpha blend flag must be there, though we cannot see/edit it :hmmm:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kendras (Post 2518168)
So, we couldn't switch on/off our lighthouses' light halo depending on day/night period ? :wah:

Maybe if I manage solving the opacity issue...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kendras (Post 2518168)
Wow, you know how to use these things ? Else, ask Jeff Grooves. :yep:

Not exactly. I can perform basic tweaks, preferably under the directions of someone who knows hex editing stuff better than me, but I am a curious guy, I like to learn, and I know how to find information on the web :03:

I wish Jeff was around. Unfortunately he has been unusually silent during the last months; I hope everything is well with him.

There are several other "old school hardcore" SHIII modders who might help us on this topic, including Anvar, but none of them has ever shown interest in our mods since when I have started cooperating with you, VonDos, MLF, LGN1, the_frog, etc.

Another modder who could offer us a valid support, is Rosomaha (Russian programmers always rock!). The last year he released in the SH5 modding section an upgrade package for S3D that makes Skwas tool fully compatible with SH5, besides adding several other improvements to it. He, like Jeff, could probably integrate the missing options in S3d. I will drop a PM to him, but unfortunately he too hasn't been active since the month of August.

In absence of better options, I will start digging inot hex editor myself, but let me know if in the meanwhile you can think of someone else who might help us :salute:


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