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-   -   Bring on the Black Holes ! (https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=141913)

Sailor Steve 09-10-08 09:07 PM
Quote:
Many women and children rushed to temples and observed fasts as they prayed for deliverance, officials and witnesses said.

"I visited temple, prayed to god," Moharana said. "I am observing the fast for safety because god can only save us."
See? It worked.

Time to convert.

Stealth Hunter 09-10-08 10:04 PM
ALL GODS ARE CHOIRBOYS WHEN IT COMES TO THOR!

http://content.answers.com/main/cont.../2/23/Thor.jpg

Wolfehunter 09-10-08 10:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Penelope_Grey
Though, if science is right, and there was nothing prior to the "big bang" where did the something come from to cause it?

I am certain of one thing... creation is something that has to be caused it can't happen by accident because of particles bumping into each other.

Not believing in God or a higher power if you will is fine... just cause you personally don't believe it doesn't mean its not there or does not exist. This is going to sound incredibly arrogant but, I'm going to say it anyway...

Science does not have all the answers. And yes... there are limits to what can be achieved.
Your right science doesn't have all the answer untill its researched, explored and perfected. Then there are results. Untill then their called theories. But time will help reveal those secrets. Trial and error is your enemy and friend. ;)

I'm not trying to put anyones faith down but there is no proof of a diety being in my eyes.

Yet I respect those who want to believe in a godly icon. That is your choice and right.

Prior to the big bang? Who knows. Could have been another universe, Maybe nothing, Maybe our universe is infinite and where limited to our technology for reaching the stars?

Time will reveal all the secrets and hopefully we don't wipe ourselves out..:damn:

antikristuseke 09-11-08 02:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Platapus
I don't mean to sound harsh, but I think it is good when the stupid people kill themselves.

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599...51-401,00.html

TEEN COMMITS SUICIDE AFTER 'END OF WORLD' CERN REPORTS

A TEENAGE girl in central India killed herself on Wednesday after being traumatised by media reports that a "Big Bang" experiment in Europe could bring about the end of the world, her father said.

The 16-year old girl from the state of Madhya Pradesh drank pesticide and was rushed to the hospital but later died, police said.

Her father, identified on local television as Biharilal, said that his daughter, Chayya, killed herself after watching doomsday predictions made on Indian news programmes.

"In the past two days, Chayya had asked me and other relatives about the world coming to an end on Sept. 10," Biharilal was quoted as saying.

"We tried to divert her attention and told her she should not worry about such things, but to no avail."

For the past two days, many Indian news channels held discussions airing doomsday predictions over a huge particle-smashing machine buried under the Swiss-French border.

The machine, called the Large Hadron Collider, was switched on on Wednesday, at the start of what experts say is the largest scientific experiment in human history.

The machine smashes particles together to achieve, on a small-scale, re-enactments of the "Big Bang" that created the universe.

Leading scientists and researchers at the European Organisation for Nuclear Research, said the experiment was safe. They dismissed as "pure fiction" doomsday predictions that the experiment could create anti-matter, or black holes.

But in deeply religious and superstitious India, fears about the experiment and the minor risks associated with it spread rapidly through the media.

In east India, thousands of people rushed to temples to pray and fast while others savoured their favourite foods in anticipation of the world's end.

"There were a thousand more devotees yesterday as well as today compared to (any) other normal day," Benudhara Sahu, a temple official in Orissa state, said.

Many women and children rushed to temples and observed fasts as they prayed for deliverance, officials and witnesses said.

Assurances by scientists and the media that nothing would happen counted for nothing for housewife Rukmini Moharana.

"I visited temple, prayed to god," Moharana said. "I am observing the fast for safety because god can only save us."
When I read the first sentence of that article i spewed coffee all over my monitor and laughed out loud. I'm a horrible person.
Feel sorry for her parents loss thought.

Penelope_Grey 09-11-08 05:22 AM
Quote:
I'd say at that point that you were being arrogant, if you meant it. I too used to "know for certain", but I've since learned that I don't actually "know" much of anything, and those that do "know for certain" are usually either fooling themselves or hiding something; both of which are scary.


Well… I don’t know exactly how the universe got made, and even if I did know exactly… I wouldn’t say. Ever. Personally, I wouldn’t want to know.

Because either a) I’d be laughed at and demonised or b) some eager egghead would believe me and have to try it out for themselves. As I say there are some things we are just better off not knowing about.

There are one or two things though that I do know for sure. But they shall have to wait for another discussion. ;)

Quote:
That was written in direct reaction to this:
Quote:
I am certain of one thing... creation is something that has to be caused it can't happen by accident because of particles bumping into each other.
Which appeared to me to be condescending.


The last thing I want to do is cause bad feeling and upset with one of the most respected forum members here, but I have to ask you…

What is condescending about me saying that I am certain creation was caused and didn’t just happen because of particles bumping around, that an external factor, an ‘unknown’ if you will was involved in said creation…?

Quote:
Your point is based on a bad piece of fiction? (Just playing here. I agree there is cause and effect, but again if no one ever tried anything we'd have no phones, no lights, no motorcars.)


Bad? I soooo beg to differ. The Matrix is jam packed with references and symbolism which is sadly often too well hidden behind Kung Fu and special effects… but the point is, cause and effect.

Also, you comparing that machine to those things is not fair IMO. A phone does not have the possibility of potentially destroying the Earth. I don’t think this thing poses any danger to us, because of reasons stated before as in… what they are trying to do, cannot be done by mere mortals and a machine.

Quote:
But many mystics and true believers claim to have just that.

I'm not trying to put you down at all. I just disagree with some of your assumptions.


Well see… that’s the thing about matters such as this. When nobody is informed of the genuine facts, disagreement will happen because of people having different ideas about it. With all due respect and I mean this with as much respect as possible…I don’t mind that you disagree with me, it really doesn’t matter one bit to me. Because in a discussion like this, really, how can anybody be sure they are the one that is truly right? Who is qualified to say whose ideas were right and whose were wrong?

Scientists like them doing this experiment are dangerous people… My biggest fear, is what will they try next after this? Maybe trying to create a mini-universe in a glass tube? Perhaps they will try to make a controlled black hole? Create a worm hole? Things like this that occur out in space naturally should not be created in a laboratory.

Wonderful if they get it right, but they get it wrong… well… nuff said! Literally!!

Penelope_Grey 09-11-08 05:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfehunter
Your right science doesn't have all the answer untill its researched, explored and perfected. Then there are results. Untill then their called theories. But time will help reveal those secrets. Trial and error is your enemy and friend. ;)

I'm not trying to put anyones faith down but there is no proof of a diety being in my eyes.

Yet I respect those who want to believe in a godly icon. That is your choice and right.

Prior to the big bang? Who knows. Could have been another universe, Maybe nothing, Maybe our universe is infinite and where limited to our technology for reaching the stars?

Some things stay secret. Immaterial of the amount of research that goes into it.

There is no proof in my eyes of a deity being either, but I don't rule out the distinct possibility of its existence either. Just because you have no proof of something does not rule out its existence or mean its not real... I think of it like this, I don't go round proving myself to the bugs in the back yard, they are lesser lifeforms than me. So, why would a higher being feel compelled to prove themselves to us?

Quote:
Time will reveal all the secrets and hopefully we don't wipe ourselves out..:damn:
We won't wipe ourselves out, the eggheads in lab coats will probably do that for us when they decide to recreate things that occur naturally in a lab. I call it tampering. Others call it research. Meh... what can ya do?

Penelope_Grey 09-11-08 05:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikhayl
Quote:
Originally Posted by Penelope_Grey
What is condescending about me saying that I am certain creation was caused and didn’t just happen because of particles bumping around, that an external factor, an ‘unknown’ if you will was involved in said creation…?
But then how got that "unknown" created, where does it come from ? :)
Prescisely! Which is my point... they won't unravel the mysteries of the universe in a lab with a pricey machine! There are just far too many questions. Which lead to even more questions.

Anyways Im gonna shut up now. :D

Mush Martin 09-11-08 05:51 AM
Action is how we fight despair

Education is how we fight fear

Experimentation is how we fight stagnation.

we must and will grow.

Skybird 09-11-08 05:53 AM
What we discover is not nature, but nature that is exposed to our way of asking questions aboiut it. (Heisenberg).

We don't perceive the universe by our senses, for it is not anywhere else than inside our heads that the electric impulses of our senses get constructed and put together into something we call our perception of the universe. So, what we witness is just our mind's dance with it's own thoughts, images and ideas. the space out there, and the space inside our mind - isn't it just the same, in the end?

Letum 09-11-08 10:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skybird
What we discover is not nature, but nature that is exposed to our way of asking questions aboiut it. (Heisenberg).

We don't perceive the universe by our senses, for it is not anywhere else than inside our heads that the electric impulses of our senses get constructed and put together into something we call our perception of the universe. So, what we witness is just our mind's dance with it's own thoughts, images and ideas. the space out there, and the space inside our mind - isn't it just the same, in the end?
Tell me Sky, is the above quote a fact about the/your universe?

Sailor Steve 09-11-08 02:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Penelope_Grey
The last thing I want to do is cause bad feeling and upset with one of the most respected forum members here,
Please, forget that 'respected' crap. I'm just a bum with too much time on his hands who posts way too much. It just gets to a point where if I disagree with somebody, they think they have to justify themselves or something. I get tired of people saying "doesn't my opinion coun't too?" Of course it does, and every bit as much as anyone else's. But sometimes I feel like mine doesn't count, or someone else thinks I'm putting them down just because I express my own. If I thought you were being condescending, well, that's just my opinion.

Quote:
What is condescending about me saying that I am certain creation was caused and didn’t just happen because of particles bumping around, that an external factor, an ‘unknown’ if you will was involved in said creation…?
Nothing at all. It was just the way you said it seemed kind of superior to me.


Quote:
Bad? I soooo beg to differ. The Matrix is jam packed with references and symbolism which is sadly often too well hidden behind Kung Fu and special effects… but the point is, cause and effect.
Beg all you want; it won't change my mind (sorry, couldn't resist. Bad joke, I know). I saw the first one, suffered through the second and didn't bother with the third. They just got on my nerves. Of course, if we're actually living in the Matrix now...

Quote:
Also, you comparing that machine to those things is not fair IMO. A phone does not have the possibility of potentially destroying the Earth. I don’t think this thing poses any danger to us, because of reasons stated before as in… what they are trying to do, cannot be done by mere mortals and a machine.

But we can't know that, and scientists become scientist because they feel driven to try. As for the "no phones" thing, that was a quote from the closing theme from Gilligan's Island, obviously a bad attempt on my part.

As for your worries on them suddenly destroying everything, you are probably right to worry. But I don't know what any of us can do to stop experimentation. By the time we found out about somebody going to far, it will probably be far too late. I grew up in the worst part of the cold war, with everybody telling us what to do in case the missiles started flying and large numbers of folks building and stocking bomb shelters. After awhile you just get jaded: if it happens it happens, and if it does there's probably not a single thing you can do about it.

I guess I'm just old and tired.:sunny:

Rhodes 09-11-08 04:29 PM
Well, again with the off topic matter, but since it's about black holes or quantum singularities, I want to ask something. It is more of the real of science fiction: in star trek, the romulan ships have quantum singularities (or black holes) as a power source and there is a british movie that in a nuclear power station they manage to create a black hole to provide energy (feed by the nuclear wastes of other centrals but the thing goes bad and they have to give more power to stabilize it and etc). How, if possibly, one can draw power from a black hole (even if this is from the realm of science fiction)?

Mush Martin 09-11-08 05:14 PM
Not my field I just need the engines for my sub:arrgh!:

Wolfehunter 09-12-08 03:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Penelope_Grey
Some things stay secret. Immaterial of the amount of research that goes into it.

There is no proof in my eyes of a deity being either, but I don't rule out the distinct possibility of its existence either. Just because you have no proof of something does not rule out its existence or mean its not real... I think of it like this, I don't go round proving myself to the bugs in the back yard, they are lesser lifeforms than me. So, why would a higher being feel compelled to prove themselves to us?

We won't wipe ourselves out, the eggheads in lab coats will probably do that for us when they decide to recreate things that occur naturally in a lab. I call it tampering. Others call it research. Meh... what can ya do?
Today and maybe for the next oh 1000 years perhaps we won't find all the secrets.

Maybe it will take tens of thousand years to figure all it out.. Maybe it will take longer?

One day we will know all the secrets. I can promise you it won't happen in my life time lol..:up:

Sorry Pen I don't believe in gods ghost vampires boogieman etc. I believe in people and what they can and can not contribute to this world in our short meager life. ;)

This science project can help science move forward in a positive way. Problem is this one with extreme low risk of an actual event causing a black hole whatever can have huge consequence IF they mess up.

Funny thing is how they can gamble with everones lives like we don't matter for the sake of science? I see a problem with that. And its not the first time they have done this...


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