The total encounters with Japanese subs, when set against the total number of hours of all boats on all patrols, was so insignificant that this is really being pedantic, IMO.

As for other vehicles using torps, care factor for me = 0, for the same reason as that above.

Point is to simulate US submarine ops, the overwhelming majority of which consisted of operating singly in assigned patrol areas (typically large) until time expired, torps expended or sub destroyed.

I'll keep saying it over and over - get all the things which matter with respect to a sub's operations and that is what will make the difference. A good example is AAA - you're a nut if you use it unless absolutely forced to do so. US subs had good air search radar and submerged as soon as they had a contact, as they weren't there to kill aircraft. Very sensible. In fact, many subs spent the majority (if not the whole) of daylight hours submerged - they could still detect ships and wouldn't be spotted from the air except through extraordinarily poor luck.

Radar, radio, periscopes (including restricted use in poor light - US subs were virtually blind through their scopes at night unless there was strong moonlight, and again just before dawn), sonar, engine/endurance factors, escort performance and weapons/systems, convoy composition and behaviour, realistic air patrols etc etc are what matter to me. Everything else is a very distant 2nd.

Im with steeltrap. This aint Grand Theft: Torpedo with a sandbox world. Focus on the submarine and its foes. Make the gameplay dynamic of the submarine hunt, the stalk, the attack, the kill and the evasion work. The rest is just filler.

No, wolfpacks does not exclude the possibility of AI subs per definition, but I agree with the others that the chances of running into another sub in real life was very slim.
Better to focus on the things that did really happen and model that perfectly.

I also agree that wolfpacks were not a major factor in US sub warfare. Most packs were formed towards the end of the war and were sent in the Sea of Japan to find shipping that was felt to be there. The fact is when the US wolfpack arrived at their general patrol area, they all split up to their own assigned area - within the packs general area - to conduct their own patrols. If possiable to have that option would be nice but not mandatory.

As far as chances of running into another sub in real life - the USS Batfish ran into three of them in one patrol in '43 and sank them all. Again this did not happen with any regularity for sure - but you could and so it should be a possibility at the min. Not an actual patrol objective though. Fact is boats coming from the Electric Boat Company on the east coast would probably have more a chance of running into a U-Boat then running into a Japanese boat while on patrol in the Pacific.

If time/space permits then let both issues be a possibility of a patrol.

Happy Hunting :ping:

"Games Convention Leipzig 06-no promotion for the game yet"

Ze Onkel Neal had asked me to talk to ubisoft representatives at the Games Convention in Leipzig (23.08-27.08.06) to see if I could squeeze out some more news and info on SH4. Unfortunately, I have practically no news for the SH4 enthusiasts. Reason: All that happened at the Games Convention was the statement to the press that SHIV will be released. There was no SH4 stand at the gamers centers, no members of the SH4 developers team had come to Leipzig, they did not even have a press kit yet. So I basically said "hello" to ubisoft from subsim. The ubisoft contact person for SH4 at least could tell me, that the official sh4 page will go online soon, probably already in September and that it is planned to soon release a list of the subs that will be playable in the game, as an appetizer so to speak.
Oh, and the ubisoft guys follow the discussions on subsim, of course. So say:"Cheese:D", everybody.
That's all. The most urgent questions concerning SH4 have been answered in the interview anyway, which you can find at the beginning of this thread.
-End of transmission-

Thanks for trying:up:

Don't get me wrong, I do want AI Japanese subs in this game. SH1 had them. SH3 and SH4 have numerous AI ships. SH4 should have a few types of AI Japanese subs that have realistic habits and behavior. For now, I am keeping quiet until I know more about the game. A few months more and we should have more info. It will not be too late to focus on a few key features and push for them...

...of course, it helps is everyone agrees on what are key features. :ping:

Even though they weren't encountered as much, the enemy subs were there. I think SH1 overdid it as far as that went. I remember seeing them on a regular basis, and I don't think the IJN had "that" many in their inventory.

I think you're right Neal, it's still a bit premature. Still plenty of time to get the most important things desired, as long as everyone can come to a mutual agreement. There are other things that can always be added later as modder add-ons, or patches.

Maybe the Devs should put a list together for what is still realistically feasable to put in, and let everyone vote on it. That way everyone has a say in what will be accomplished by the release date. I'm sure they have lots to pick and choose from, and this would let the community participate in what gets added, and what can be dropped for the time being. And if everything gets done ahead of schedule, they can maybe pull a few things from the grab bag if there's time enough left.

One thing that has bugged me is that every sub sim never has any ships colliding after a torpedo attack. Not that it should happen all the time, but once in a while, it would be nice to see a couple ships make a turning error and run into each other. It did happen from time to time, panick and a hasty order to start turning the wrong direction. It's been close in SHIII but no cigar. The ships always seem to stop and reverse before impacting.

Even if they didn't have time to put everything in, it would be nice to see an add on come out six months later with more of what we would like, such as more ship types, AI subs, extra aircraft types, maybe even a extra playable sub or two.

I'm not going to jump to conclusions on the game before it's finished, as we don't know what in or out. I just hope they get it stable and easy to use.

From what I've seen it looks good, but it's hard to tell from a 60 second Video and a couple of screen shots.

Let's not be to hard on the dev team, remember, there human too:up:

Hehe, hello back to you, too, ubi!

/waves

What are the odds eh? running into a japanese sub on patrol or passing an ubi soft representative on these boards?

As for AI subs, nice to have them, but I _REALLY_ put that lower on my list of things I want improved in SHIV.

My own pet peeve is to get the manual target solution making to work better. With mod tools and a tutorial I got pretty good at it in SH3. But it was obvious to me that the designers didn't entirely understand how it worked, and therefore didn't give us the proper tools for it.

I hope so much this aspect will be fixed. That and the 8000 m visibility range of SH3 (for shame!)

They do watch the boards, friend, we know that beyond all doubt. They just apparently have a policy of "staying submerged". Each to their own.

Has to take a ton of persistance, watching this board as a lurker and not registering and posting:p.

I'm going to say I"m interested in the Idea of doing new and different missions, but what exactly are the New and Improved upgrades over SH3? Of course it is early on...so we dont know for sure, but this Q/A session didnt seem to put the idea that SH4 is New and improved over SH3. Nothing seemed to jump out at me and say "WOW, this is something I Must go out and buy". Some good stuff put out...but some definite major downers as well.

Waiting for more!

Yup... they most certainly are here. Wanna know why they prefer to stay under cover?

From this thread alone...

"some definite major downers"
"it was obvious to me that the designers didn't entirely understand how it worked, "
"Well here are the downers for SH4 for me:"
"I expected more out of SH4 and so far it died out pretty quickly for me"
"a mod that would allow us to play in pacifig in sh3 sounds more interesting than sh4 "
"Ubisoft using that crappy star-force copy protection junk"
"I smell a rat every time the game is 'tuned' for an american audience "
"It is a quest for the teenage arcade audience "
"is really putting me off this game"
" 8000 m POS that SH3 launched with"
"You all really need to open your eyes and look at the bigger picture once in a while."

With between 5 and 7 months to go can you blame them for staying submerged?

JCC

John is dead on the money.

And just as a side note, I remember reading a Silent Hunter III interview where the developers stated that they didn't think it'd be a good idea to have a delay from the time you gave orders to when the order was carried out. They used a scenario where you need to rapidly crash-dive as an example (and admittedly, it would probably save a good deal of German subs and doom a good deal of enemy merchants and warships if orders were carried out instantly).

Yet, here we are, playing a Silent Hunter III where it takes several seconds for an order to be carried out. You hit the hot-key, the appropriate officer acknowledges and passes the order on, and then the crew starts to execute it. It's great.

So don't worry so much, people. Changes happen.

Can you blame us??? Really?? Come on......we just represent the part of the Subsim community that actually (or at least puts it out there) wants a something new and improved....is that so much to ask for?? Sure it is way early in the developement...but this is the time to push (actually a little late) to make damn sure you get a top notch product. Anyone actually remember the development of SH3???? That game was not even suppose to have a Campaign:huh:

I'll be the first to admit that the level of whining and groaning with SH3 got to the point of everyone thinking they deserved a specific add on to the game. But some obvious things where just left out that 90% of everyone wanted....for whatever reason (I think time was the critical factor). Now when they tell you " For now, the stations will remain the same. We still believe that captain’s job keeps him in the command and attack center of the sub most of the time."...come on...honestly...read between the lines!