It got real bad 15 years ago but until 2007 it was slowing improving.

Photos of the damage here:
http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums...vember-24-2010

Any of our resident army/marine guys know what kind of round this is?

http://img528.imageshack.us/img528/8164/rtyryt.jpg

http://joongangdaily.joins.com/_data...1/24230846.jpghttp://joongangdaily.joins.com/_data...1/24230840.jpg

From here: http://joongangdaily.joins.com/artic...sp?aid=2928852

They make some interesting claims there about the counter-attack, but don't offer much to support them.

I wasn't army or marine, but i'd call that a UXO. Whoever took that photo, is an idiot if they weren't using a telephoto lens, or part of of an EOD team.

I don't see any fins, but it's long enough to make me think rocket. BM-21?

Let's play a little scenario

First the prepolitical scenario

South Korea's Government are awaiting the outcome from the UN-Security meeting. Again the chinese have votede against a strong complain against North korea.

The South Korean government feel that they are on they own, so the president calls the president of the USA and have a talk with Obama.

Obama ask his alliede to stand down and not to do any thing that could escalate the tension in this area. Obama tells him, that USA will help South Korea. After the south korean president have hunged up he knows that not even from the great allied they can count on any help of any kind.

Even the North Korea knows that and the day after the UN-meeting they start sending shells over the DMZ again. South response but only with some few missiles.

The people in south korea are demostrating on the street. They want revenge now.

The government feel a huge press on they shoulder...

What happens next... Maybe nothing.

This scenario is a fantasy made from all information I've got from the news and my knowledge from this area.

You are free to continue my "story"

Regards
Markus

Definitely! Compare what you see above to the bottom right picture here:

http://www.ddrafg.com/images/Heavy%2...ages/bm-21.jpg

Looks like the fins got blown off. Given what it is (the very tail end), maybe it's not even UXO but just a fragment blown off after the round exploded?

Ohh by the way. Some weeks ago a friend send me this link

http://www.eutimes.net/2010/03/nostr...-iii-for-2010/

It was send to me on Nov 16th
I remembered the story about 5 minutes after the first news from South Korea.

I do NOT belive it!!

Markus

That's a rather interesting site... :doh:

My favourite so far:

If I were Putin, I'd ask for new analysts...

I hope he sent it as a laugh, as that is one real crazy site.

Some info on the ROK counter attack: http://english.chosun.com/site/data/...112500536.html

Karl Kraus wrote, "How is the world ruled, and how do wars start? Diplomats tell lies to journalists, and then believe what they read."

ID has some analysis on the US move into the Yellow Sea: http://www.informationdissemination....n-gunboat.html


An interesting point he makes is that although an attack against CSG-73 is unlikely, there will be some response from the PRC. They're going to be humiliated that it happened again, and they'll need to save face somehow.

Any theories on what that response could be?

Exciting? :haha:

Joke aside this shelling is an overt aggression on the part of North Korea and the victims include civilian and civilian property.

That's nothing short than an act of war but given the unique situation in Korea peninsula which ended in armistice, South may not feel compelled to respond with an all out war and that's certainly the very reason of the coming US fleet to the yellow sea: to rein in North Korea and PREVENT war by show of force.

China doesn't want war either because its main concern now is to sustain its economic growth to fuel its growing political and military power and it wants to expand its sphere of influence to Asia countries and it would not be helping itself by asserting North Korea latest shelling on South Korea island.

It would thus be politically best for China to remain passive and quiet while South Korea and US play their show of force card.

This is not Cheonan sinking which was covert and deniable.

But if China decided to go aggressive it would reveal to the world how it would expand its sphere of influence to other Asia pacific countries i.e through military force and intimidation which would not help bringing in friends in the long term and propel further arm races in the pacific especially South East Asia countries which remain until today relatively poorly armed.

I'd worry about North Korea reaction though than China objection to US fleet in its waters of influence.

But all these are just my personal opinion and I'm clearly not an expert and have no idea the psyche of the Chinese leadership. Just my 2 cents.
If I were the Chinese leader I would stay quiet. I would neither try to pressure North Korea but would not try to prevent US fleet to do their show of force to rein in North Korea into some sense either.