I like your ideas too. One of the things that immediately strikes me when I've been aboard warships is the sound. Adding more crew feedback would add a lot to the sense of activity in addition to being more realistic.

Give us the SDK !
Consider this signed ! :D

Isn't it about time that this petition was delivered to sonalysts so that they can act upon it?

They have man visiting this forum time to time. I just guess they don't care about petitions. I wouldn't.

Unfortunately it is difficult ro convey irony in a post.I know that a scs chap visits from time to time but the chance of us getting this sdk are as good as me becoming the King of Great Britain!!

No, we get irony just fine. (grin)

We're still trying to figure out a way to get the company a return on any investment in addtional DW work.

The fact it's still slowly selling helps... naval sims may not be a big niche, but they have long lives! We're all grateful you're still having fun with it.

I do not have all the details on how DW dovetails into any of the other work you may do for the goverment. If DW DOES have some function in the goverment contracts then how about pitching it like I did earlier in this thread.

I honestly would not like to see the ability to add new playables, but to be able to add things into the simulation to make it more immersive. Immersion is a HUGE factor in any simulation. We understand that giving us the tools you use to make things for DW, and that these tools may be for your goverment contracted projects, could be a violation of contracts and/or laws. How about giving us the specs so we could make our OWN tools or adapt others for the purpose.

As the mod community makes things, you may be able to move it over to the other side and save the R&D on coding & debugging. There is a large community of us ex-bubbleheads who play this sim and we could, and would, steer the modders in the correct general directions. We would not give away the secrets, but give them a good general idea to work with.

As the game is added to, then maybe others will come aboard and purchase the game. You have a GREAT starting point. Let us flesh it out! Let us build on what you started and bring it to the pinnacle of the SIM market.

You say that there is not much of a market for a sim of this type? I think you are wrong. I think it needs to be even MORE of a sim than it is. It needs to FEEL like you are there, giving the orders, listening to the crew react. People play sims like that to experience things they read about, see on TV, or listen to stories about. They want a slice, however small, of what they hear about or saw. Look at some of the other military sims out there. Those that are successful have the TONS of MODS and patches out there for them. Sometimes what generates the most sales is word of mouth. They need to see people talking about it, having their socks blown off by the sim. Then they buy it to find out what all the hype is about. That is what got me to buy Subsim 4, and I am not that much of a fan of the diesel boats. Let me tell you, without the mods, I would have uninstalled the game already. The mods make it MUCH more immersive and puts you in the action instead of just clicking a mouse.

You speak of Return on Investment. How much would it cost Sonalyst to let us do some serious modding? How much money can be made of using the simulation, fleshed out and modded to make it more immersive and useful as a training tool. How much time and effort would be saved if you had some ready made code available from some modder that addressed a new issue that a goverment contract required. Ammend the EULA to REQUIRE that any mod for DW be open sourced and all code and tools required in its making be FREE and all source code available. Who knows, maybe we will suprise you and make a better tool than you currently have. This way you can use anything created for your own purposes.

Thank you

Thats simple unlock all ships and subs or allow us to unlock them.

Why? Its the current trend (the age of Mod). Perfect example: Rfactor.
Plus, as we are many and live in diferent countries, we would like to "drive" our national "toys", and not always the same boring US/Russian "toys" present in almost every sim.

Like myself i would like to "drive" a Meko2000 or a U212 type sub.

So what i'm trying to say its: today, a modable (sp?) game sells more than an unmodable one.


EDIT: oops i didn't even saw Bubblehead nuke's post, so... what he said. :)

Well, it helps when the majority of possible buyers for such a product realize that Dangeous Waters is probably the first, best, and last multi-platform modern naval sim... unless they buy it. :)

So, it's not like anyone who suddenly decides they want to play a command sim focused on modern naval warfare has any other choice, or is waiting for some other product to come out.

So, patience young SCS grasshoppas... :rotfl:

Cheers,
David

I'm just wondering if there is any point in continuing this thread since SCS aren't ever going to release an SDK. Our best hope lies with Dr Sid.

I wonder what the development costs were and how many have been sold?The Perry/P3 should have had a few different operating countries.It was basically a US/Russian oriented game.Perhaps more discussion with the community would have helped before they spent any $$$.I certainly do not remember any public discussion.

What we need for immediate release is a standalone replay software or the format of the files so we can make a piece of sotfware by ourself.
I ask some months ago (April 2007) if SCS can release the format of the replay and I am still waiting an answer from Friyng Tiger (" I'll ask a coder and see what the deal is with the replay format. I have no clue if it's proprietary or not.").
I think if they can't give us the file format of the replay (a very strategic info:D) they never make a SDK.

SCS has said many times in the past that and SDK won't be made available and given the lack of response from SCS here and at their own forum DW is no longer of interest to them. Therefore I think this thread is redundant now. Dr Sid is moving along with his sim which promises to be more in depth in the areas people have thought are limited in DW.

OK, I'm officially intrigued by this statement. What sim? Doc Sid......can you give us some more insight into your plans? I'm sorry, but I don't know anything about your planned sim and I'd like to know more about it.

Are you totally sure about that? I certainly hope that's not the case. I'm still playing DW quite regularly and I'm still very much interested...so that would be quite disheartening if true.

When one's game is either failing and/or old then encouraging deep mods with a SDK or even the engine source code is one of the old tricks of the gaming industry.

Quake was a engine that went down in history as the most modified project in history. Its source code is still being tweaked and used today. It gave birth to Half life and its mods as well as its own rich modding community.

So DW diddnt sell big bucks... So what? Do you want your biggest public product to meet it's demise simply because you think there are bigger fish elseware?

I do not see what your big problem with custom playable craft are when you no longer support the engine. You no longer have any interest in making pay addons yet you want to deny a potentally great way to add in extra trickle funds?

Sad really :down:

I suppose they are making still big bucks off DW ... tho not the freely available version of DW but the Government one which they sold to the DoD (amongst others).

So don't expect a SDK or something similar because they would shoot themselves in the foot by releasing such tools (their "other" customers would rightly think ... why pay huge fees when we can do all modifications ourselves).

So my guess ... DW is a success and still running, just not on the Retail market (i.e. where we can buy it).

I can hardly believe that the .gov is having to rely on SCS to provide them with new "playables". Matter of fact I refuse to believe this is the case because the critical info on these craft are highly classified.

So obviously DW for the .gov is a stripped down DW without the obviously wrong public domain info. This version is obviously designed for the agents in the navy to plug in the real numbers and run their simulations in secret.

I could hardly think the gov will suddenly find the public version. (Which obviously has added realism breakers so that the bad guys wont be able to suddenly use it anymore than SH3) More attractive unless they want versions they can send home with the cadets for practice. Again rather pointless cause SCS gets the money anyway.

SCS is a govt. contractor, the DW we have from what I understand is the same as the Dod version but we haven't been furnished with details on that and an SDK would allow us to find them out.

So like I said is it worth having this thread. Gor ead the official SCS forum adn you will see there has been hardly any comment by SCS for the past 6 months.

Yes this thread is worth it as it is a public call.