"We no longer have the original tapes of our 9/11 coverage (for reasons of cock-up, not conspiracy)."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/theeditor...onspiracy.html

And, on the other hand:
http://www.tms.org/pubs/journals/jom...agar-0112.html

Building 7:
http://www.debunking911.com/pull.htm

Maybe people are so heated up because all those other informations had been lies (Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz, Powell, and their WMDs in Iraq), so they thought this also was -
Hmm, seems i can make up my mind now.

Maybe they did not examine everything because it was obvious to everyone what happened there.
Now....imagine them looking for evidence of demolition just in case... so that the truthers in the future had no reason to ask questions about why they did not look for the evidence....of demolition...then again they probably had known something but hid it from the public otherwise why they would look for anything like that unless it was suspected.

Just apply opposite action/reaction logic to any tragedy...in particular with some screw ups involved or lack of foresight(or paranoia) and here we have conspiracy.


Why the building collapsed?
Some steel beams had been destroyed others damaged while the others damaged and heated to high temperatures which made them weaker.
There had been still lots of floors above to support.
It was a big passenger plane went through the middle of WTC :damn:


............

.............

Well I know that some things don't scale down evenly. Weight and inertia for example. It's very difficult to make something that weighs an ounce act like something that weighs many tons, especially once you put it in motion. I would look at any attempt to recreate the destruction of the WTC using scaled models with a very critical eye.

And how do you know this? because some 'experts' made an educated guess perhaps? why should anyone believe them over the
'experts' that say that it cannot be? (or vice versa?)

It may well be the plausible theory, but it's still just a theory - In terms of the impact damage, all anyone can really establish from the video footage is the exact number of perimeter columns that were completely knocked out..... but thats about it.

Forget about conspiricy claims of 'explosives' because they are totally irrelivent.

The REAL question is this:
Since when are we in the business of accepting 'theories' to provide us with a conclusion on any major man-made disaster such as 9/11?

For example; tell me -how many aviation disasters have there been, where witnesses provided enough visual information so that FFA & NTSB decided, "ah that will do, lets not bother with examining the wreckage this time, its probably just what it looks like, Case closed fellas"
The answer is 'N-E-V-E-R', because it is their duty
to the victims families, to airline passengers wordwide And to the airline & aviation industries - to fully estabish the precise cause. If that means going though every last piece of wreckage with a fine tooth comb (more than once if needed.) then so be it.
We have learned to expect nothing less.

Look at the Titanic also, Sure they knew that it sunk because 'it hit an iceberg' they knew that on the day it happened. And yet, once we got the technology we took the time, effort and money to examine the wreck in detail to deterime the exact point of failiure as poor quality rivet bolts.
But for 9/11, we just couldnt be bothered I suppose?


So going back the WTC Fire collapes.
1) what was the full extent of the impact damage to the central core columns - nobody really knows.
2) where were the exact points of structural failure, was is the columns, the trusses or what? nobody really knows.
3) How much of the steels integrity was lost, before it buckled?, nobody really knows.
4) Are other structures of similar design also at risk of catastrophic failure from fire? nobody really knows.

So I guess it doesnt really matter then, huh.

I no longer care for the arguments of the 'Truther' or the 'debunker', both are based on speculation, crude simulation, probability and even imagination :doh:. All of these things 'prove' stuff all.
I actually dont belive in a re-investiagtion into 9/11, because unlike the Titanic its too late. You cant investigate the 'cause of death' after the body has already been cremated.
But I do believe those who authorised the destruction of this crime scene should be put on trial.

Except that they do know:
http://www.popularmechanics.com/tech...ecture/4278874

Quote:

Conspiracy theorists have long claimed that explosives downed World Trade Center 7, north of the Twin Towers. The long-awaited report from the National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST) conclusively rebuts those claims. Fire alone brought down the building, the report concludes, pointing to thermal expansion of key structural members as the culprit. The report also raises concerns that other large buildings might be more vulnerable to fire-induced structural failure than previously thought.

Except they they dont.
Did they write that report based on analysing the debris? Nope - they conducted it by analysing 'Video footage'.
http://www.nist.gov/public_affairs/f..._qa_082108.cfm
last time I checked, that's exactly what the truthers do as well. :doh: That report is just more of the same old crap.

Also they did analyze the debris:

One small point....
It was NOT aviation disaster of unknown cause or suspected terrorist attack.

"Analysis of the WTC steel for the elements in thermite/thermate would not necessarily have been conclusive."

And Neither is that statement to be honest, anyway who said anything about thermite/themate?, not me! (other than 'lets forget about it')

Anyway.

Available measurements of SFRM thickness from inspections made during the SFRM application
Not an inspection of the Debris
Review of photographs of WTC 7 beams and columns taken during renovations
Not an inspection of the Debris
Inspection of the building at 130 Liberty Street
130 Liberty Street is not WTC building 7
An analysis of the SFRM thickness for trusses in the WTC towers showed
Again this in an 'analysis of messurements, Not an inspection of the Debris.
A thermal analysis of a steel plate (e.g., modeling a beam flange) with gaps in the SFRM showed that occasional gaps in the SFRM did not significantly alter the thermal response of the structural member. (NIST NCSTAR 1-6, Chapter 2)
Analysis of a model is not an inspection of the Debris.

This report is from 2008 and conducted years after the event. And it was conducted as result of complaints that the case of WTC7 was entirely missing from the orginal NIST report that proceeded it.
The Debris was long gone by then anyway, maybe there were a few 'samples' left -as there is for towers 1 and 2, but those were not collected as part of any kind of forensic investigation, it was just a small random selection kept for the sake of preservation.

You said:

However:

and

Also:

http://www.nist.gov/el/disasterstudi.../wtc_about.cfm

More quotes out of context.
I love it when the "your responses suggest a conspiracy" nonsense, though: if people don't seem to care, they're sheep and there's a CT. If they do care, it somehow proves there's still a CT. Somehow.

Really. CTers are a special breed. I honestly don't get them.


More CT-er jargon. "Disinformation (noun)": any statement or fact that contradicts my preconceived conspiracy theory

No, the answer is 'N-E-V-E-R' (just a little melodramatic there) because the NTSB's job is to determine the exact cause of the crash. In this case the cause was obvious, and the film is there for all to see exactly why the planes crashed. There was no wreckage to examine because the aluminum planes plowed head-on into buildings made of steel, and were vaporized by the impact and subsequent fireballs. Any possible surviving wreckage fell hundreds of feet to the ground, pulverized inside thousands of tons of falling steel.

That is the reason there was no investigation into the crashes, because there was nothing left to investigate.

You really are reaching here, in an effort to prove that there has to have been a conspiracy. You've shown nothing so far, try as you might to convince everyone.

When I read your answer, I remember that I somewhere had read that NTSB was prevented to investigate. So I have been searshing the internet and found this

"in one of your articles, you have written that "the NTSB has confirmed that-apparently for the first time from its inception, in 1967, since when it has investigated more than 124,000 other aviation accidents-it took no part in investigating any of the air crashes which occurred on September 11, 2001." Do you mean that the National Transportation Safety Board refused to investigate the 9/11 air crashes? Was it ordered by a superior authority to do so? What does the fact that NTSB didn't investigate the 9/11 air crashes imply?

You have mentioned that FBI similarly refused to release any information about any debris recovered from the crash sites under the Freedom of Information Act. Do you want to imply that the U.S. administrative organizations such as FBI and NTSB have been complicit in the 9/11 attacks?
Anthony Lawson: That is correct. The NTSB did not take part in the painstaking procedure of examining what was left of the four aircraft to determine that they were indeed the same aircraft which were allegedly hijacked that morning. Two of the allegedly hijacked aircraft: American Airlines Flight 11 and United Airlines Flight 175 were claimed, by the Bush administration, to have been the planes which impacted the North Tower and South Tower, respectively, each flown by Arabs who, it later transpired, had never flown a wide-bodied commercial jet before. Aircraft debris, including parts of an undercarriage and fuselage of the North Tower plane were certainly photographed, and the still-smoking core of what must have been the right engine of the South Tower plane can be seen, in several videos, arcing its way down towards Murray and Church streets, were it was videoed and photographed. Later, an identifiable photograph of this same engine core was released, by a former FEMA official photographer, as it was about to be buried in a landfill on Staten Island. This was an important section of a murder weapon, as were the aircraft parts found in or near the North Tower; the debris from the alleged crash site of United Flight 93 and that of American Airlines 77 which allegedly crashed into the Pentagon.

As to the second part of the question, I very much doubt that the NTSB would have been in a position to refuse to investigate the crashes. I should say that were dissuaded from doing so. The FBI, backed up by the Justice Department has refused to release any details about the aircraft parts or the serial numbers of the Black Boxes that may or may not have been found at the crash sites, although the contents of one of them-the Cockpit Voice Recorder from alleged United 93-formed the basis of several documentaries and an Academy-Award-winning movie, yet the transcript of the recording did not carry the serial number of the device on which it was, allegedly, recorded. "
The whole story here:
http://www.rense.com/general93/anthn.htm

I can't say if it true or not, just that I have read it.



Markus

I'm surprised you would quote that article at all, given the beliefs of the interviewee.
I'm so glad you could find an unbiased, honest source.