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-   -   CHESS MATCH: Skybird vs Fatty (https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=149909)

UnderseaLcpl 04-06-09 10:50 PM

OMFG:o

A Very Super Market 04-06-09 10:54 PM

Crikey, its an intense game, but methinks that is about to change.

Skybird 04-07-09 04:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fatty (Post 1079204)
20. Qb4xc4 Qd8-b6

21. Qc4xc6+

My prrreciousss...!

http://img17.imageshack.us/img17/9704/screenshot3i.jpg

I always loaded a separate screenshot program to shoot a pic - and now I realise that below the GUI window with the 3D board there is a button reading ""Screenshot" :dead:

Skybird 04-07-09 11:26 AM

If this would be football, we would have halftime for a regular match length of 40 moves, and these are the first 20 moves:

http://img237.imageshack.us/img237/7868/image1nya.jpg

Despite the sad mishap with h6, I see this match as the most difficult match I ever played since we started these chess threads on this board three years ago. Obviously White has an advantage now, and I honestly do not fear to lose this anymore, but if Black plays correctly, I still have not secured a safe victory here. But for that half of a point you will need to fight, Fatty! :arrgh!:

Since at least some people seem to occasionally jump in and have a look at how it is going, I could give those parts of my analysis that are no longer relevant for the future proceedings in this match, if there is interest in that:

Since I bought my new widescreen monitor in January, I can arrange a virtual 3D board in a way that it matches size and perspective of a real 40x40 cm board, and I have abandoned my old habit to use two boards and the screen-board during analysis, and now do it all completely on one or two virtual boards exclusively. that has the nice side-effect that I must not make notes anymore - the software logs every move I do on the screen, and sorts the variations I enter hierarchically in the notation. By then clicking into the notation, I can quick-jump to the according positions, and thus can compare previously calculated variations easily.

I love this chessbase GUI ! With this big monitor, and these nice 3D boards, I have gone virtual completely here. But after all this talking about computer assistance and what I do with it, and Neal'S questioning remark some weeks ago, I just want to stress again that I do not use any active engine assisting me - just the GUI to log the match and keep written records of my analysis.

fatty 04-07-09 03:58 PM

21. Qc4xc6+ Qb6xc6

If 22. Bg2xc6+ then 22. ... Bc8-d7.

fatty 04-07-09 04:04 PM

Yeah, Chessmaster has the feature where you can branch off into different variations from whatever moves. I cannot imagine approaching a game like this, comparing moves over the better part of a day, with only a single physical board and pieces... recalling from my first game with Lance the frustration even trying to set the pieces back to their original position after playing ahead a few moves.

What software are you using again?

UnderseaLcpl 04-07-09 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fatty (Post 1079631)
recalling from my first game with Lance the frustration even trying to set the pieces back to their original position after playing ahead a few moves.

Arena w/o engines should help with that. You can play out your variations and then rewind to the original state of play. I used it in our match because I assumed you were using it as well. In the event that you were not, I might be compelled to call our draw a loss for me.

In any case, might be a useful tool to develop your skills. Having a faithful record of variations you have tried helps you to identify crucial squares and develop effective attack/defense positions in face-to-face matches.

Skybird 04-07-09 04:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fatty (Post 1079626)
21. Qc4xc6+ Qb6xc6

If 22. Bg2xc6+ then 22. ... Bc8-d7.

23. Bc6xd7+

If your move 23.../Ke8xd7 then my move 24. Ke1-d2


http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/3...chscreenie.jpg

Skybird 04-07-09 04:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fatty (Post 1079631)
Yeah, Chessmaster has the feature where you can branch off into different variations from whatever moves. I cannot imagine approaching a game like this, comparing moves over the better part of a day, with only a single physical board and pieces... recalling from my first game with Lance the frustration even trying to set the pieces back to their original position after playing ahead a few moves.

What software are you using again?

Chessbase, the Fritz 11-GUI. Note that the GUI by chessbase always is Fritz"xyz", but there is also an engine named Fritz. I highlx recommend it, they are world market leader and I think they really have the best interface there is, not too mention the best-looking one as well.

http://www.chessbase.com/products/fritz11/index.htm

Plenty of usefull functions for training, assisting beginners, analysis, keeping track of correspondence chess matches (in tournaments you always play many of these simultaneously), and a doizen oif 3D boards, three or four of which are really great to use.

In my active tournament days 20 years back, I used to do analysis on two boards, and using these albums to keep positons and records logged:

http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/1897/img0474aet.jpg

http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/6364/img0476fhv.jpg

Alredy back then I wrote down everything own my mind, my memory never was as good as it would be desired in chess.

But when I imagine that I did in handwriting what now the computer does for me in keeping in written record after I just virtually moved the pieces - the horror... the horror... The early matches we did on this board in 2006 I still did that way...

http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/4815/image9m.jpg

In handwriting, that would be pages over pages...

Skybird 04-07-09 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UnderseaLcpl (Post 1079637)
Arena w/o engines should help with that. You can play out your variations and then rewind to the original state of play. I used it in our match because I assumed you were using it as well. In the event that you were not, I might be compelled to call our draw a loss for me.

In any case, might be a useful tool to develop your skills. Having a faithful record of variations you have tried helps you to identify crucial squares and develop effective attack/defense positions in face-to-face matches.

You have nothing you must apologize for, Lance. You did not take any calculating help from the engine, and how you organise your analysis, is your business alone. We have an agreement to not use active engines here, and I have no doubt we all stick to that. but note that in official correpondence chess, rules do not say that using engines are ruled out. Not only for pragmatism, since it cannot be controlled, but because in corr. chess even chess engines meet their limits in certain fields: longterm strategy, for example. Every master and grandmaster uses engines to check his matches for tactical mistakes though. Players take their positionss into the club and ask others. On serious playing levels, a master player may even sit together with his team.

If you want to maximise your chances playing against an engine, keep your position closed as long as possible, play it calm and avoid tactical fireworks - becasue in these computers become the more suprior the more complex and coinfused things become. the more open a position becomes, the stronger most engines play. Never forget that in tactical short term calculations, an engine after just one minute can reach 15 to 20 half moves calculation depth - that is a value most trained players only could reach if the variations are enforced. Inside this calculation depth, engines tend to not miss something, if they are allowed to play without artificial brakes and handicaps. But there are differences between engines in "knowledge" they include in digital format: that'S why for example the claculation speed of Fritz 10 is slower than that of Fritz 5 (which had less "knoweldge" encoded it had to check for every move), and Fritz 5 still being a famous brute force analysis engine, although it is ten years old. On the other hand, Hiarcs also is a famous engine ( I like it very much), but Hiarcs 10 reaches only around half the speed, in mean, than Fritz 11 which is two or three years younger. Beside Fritz and Hiarcs, these three engines: Shredder, Rybka and Junior are the dominating engines on the market today. Rybka 2.2 even can be get for free both for Chessbase and Arena GUI, now that version 3 is out.

fatty 04-07-09 08:13 PM

24. Ke1-d2 Kd7-e6

Cool. Where do you find stuff like that album? I've wanted to buy a nice board and set for a while to play with friends and guests, guess I'd have to turn to the web.

Skybird 04-08-09 04:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fatty (Post 1079722)
Cool. Where do you find stuff like that album? I've wanted to buy a nice board and set for a while to play with friends and guests, guess I'd have to turn to the web.

Hard to get these days, with computers and email and all that. Try here, else I found a link to a Kolumbian shop.

https://www.schachversand.de/startse...erial/569.html

The Chessilette albums that I used went out of sale already over 20 years ago. They held up to 8 boards, were robust, but also very expensive. Then there were adhesive PVC-boards that did not work too well, travelling boards with Velcro tape (very good, but also no longer available), and some kind of clip-locks. Today, I assume most CC players store their matches via PC.

P.S. The link is somewhat messed up, I cannot link directly to the page I want. From the linked page, click "Onlineshop", then "Sets, Boards", and under "select type of material" search for "correspondence chess (19)"

Skybird 04-08-09 05:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fatty (Post 1079722)
24. Ke1-d2 Kd7-e6

25. Kd2-d3

http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/3...chscreenie.jpg

Skybird 04-08-09 07:29 AM

Like many people, I hate end games, I admit, they are my weak spot. Especially Rook endgames I dislike - they are the most complex and difficult ones. And unfortunately also the most common ones.

Guess what I did do in the past 90 minutes. :88) This match is not decided at all, really. :doh:

porphy 04-08-09 03:43 PM

yes, the rook end game is very complicated. I once had a full book dedicated to rook end games. Sold it, as I never had the patience to get into that one... Things looks deceptively easy, but a slight upper hand can quickly slip out of your hands and even turn into defeat... Watch out everyone! :DL


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