But...but...why go through that pain first? If you're that decadent anyway, just come to America where you can have it all in THIS life!:rotfl:

As a soldier I will not go into detailed comments as I will be keel hauled without a doubt. But if you really want to know what people think; ask the mothers, fathers, sisters, brothers, sons & daughters who have lost a soldier to these fanatics within this religion.

Majority of wars are started by religion and that is a fact of life.

I'll shut up now :shifty:

Now I am curious!

Well it is important to remember that the whole 72 virgins was a story perpetrated by the occidental media. There is no mention of 72 virgins in the Holy Qur’an. One of the first media stories that discussed this was a 60 Minutes program in 2001. However that story was adamantly challenged by islamic scholars.

In the Hadith, there is mention of 72 wives. This is listed in Hadith 2562. “The Book of Description of the Garden". In this context garden is given to mean to paradise.

"Sawda (Tirmidhi’s grandfather) reported that he heard from Abdullah, who received from Rishdin b. Sa’d, who in turn learned from Amr b. al-Harith, from Darraj, from Abul-Haytham, from Abu Sa’id al-Khudri, who received it from the Apostle of God [Muhammad]: The least [reward] for the people of Heaven is 80,000 servants and 72 wives, over which stands a dome of pearls, aquamarine and ruby, as [wide as the distance] between al-Jaabiyya and San’a."

So we have a story told by a guy who heard it from a guy who heard it from a guy.......

While the Holy Qur’an is considered impeccable, the Hadith is not.

What is interesting is that the Hadith not only prohibits the killing of innocents but also prohibits suicide (hadiths 257 and 258).

"Whoever commits suicide with a piece of iron will be punished with the same piece of iron in Hell. Whoever commits suicide by throttling shall keep on throttling himself in Hell [forever], and whoever commits suicide by stabbing shall keep on stabbing himself in Hell [forever]."

Rabbi Reuven Firestone wrote “So suicide is forbidden, killing of noncombatants is forbidden, but martyrdom is rewarded with entrance into heaven and, therefore, with great material rewards in the world to come. We are beginning to uncover the complexity of the problem. It rests to a great extent on interpretation and the authority of those who make the interpretations. One stable person’s definition of suicide may be interpreted as martyrdom by a fanatic. All these categories may be easily manipulated by fanatical, desperate, or evil people. A reasonable person’s obvious identification of innocent noncombatants may be categorized as Satan’s hordes by someone who is desperate and confused. Add to this the fact that most, though not all, suicide bombers are in desperate economic straits.”

So it all comes down to the inconvenient fact. Suicide bombers and terrorists may claim Islam as their foundation, but their very acts brand them apostates.

Terrorists may be many things but muslims they aint.:nope:

I have no problem with people having a different religous belief. But when they use it to advance a political point, or use it as a reason to murder, that's a different topic altogether. I think your question is too broad in nature, as there are plenty of muslim believers wh odon't believe in violence as their own teachings state.

Religions are wonderful grand lofty ideas, and purport high ideals. Religous followers, now that's a different topic.

True enough but I think a few keyboards were on fire...;)

The gist of what I meant was, it's getting harder to know who your friends are anymore. I have Muslim friends whom I known for years and they are simply appalled at what is going on in the Middle East and I would no sooner believe they would wish harm on anyone.

To judge any group of people by the actions of a statistical few is doing an injustice to the others.

I believe that is the basis of bigotry and prejudice.

Characterizing the many by observation of the few is not only statistically illogical but morally repugnant.

That's usually how religions get started :-D

I'll send a few terrorist woodlouses to attack their PC's. I've found a way to attach snappers to their backs. All they need to is fall hard enough inside the PC to cause damage (snappers are those little gun-powder fireworks that you throw on the ground and make that annoying pop sound; they also hurt like hell when you throw them and have no shoes on).

its all madness.
as i say, us europeans have no need at all of religion and we have progressed well enough.
its had its day..200 years ago if anyone had a serious problem with painful teeth they saw the blacksmith who then used tongs to pull the rotten tooth out (possibly even the wrong tooth)
that was the norm. today we have learned that there is a better way.
if any dentist in the civilised world did that 2day hed be in prison and the talk of the week!!
thats progress
3rd world land needs religion to keep some kind of order we have been there got the tee shirt etc etc

Well "I" was not gonna say that, but I am glad someone did :up:

As a Subsim member and a Western Muslim I answered yes obviously. :)

I'm only uncomfortable (gross understatement) with the tiny minority who want to blow me up along with the tiny minority on the other side who want to deport me from my country of birth, ban my religion and so on. To hell with both of em. :down:

And that is my contribution to this thread. I have lost count how many times I have had to discuss and debate my faith and religion on this forum. I guess they are just the rubbish cards that I have been dealt. So I play my crummy hand as best as I can. For my sanity I tend to just fold.

As to all these Muslim threads of recent. I just call it that "time of the month".

I'll conclude by quoting Skybird of all people regarding Muslims/Islam topics from this thread:

Indeed. :yep:

Edited: Added quote and corrected some below par grammar.

I'm comfortable with Muslims/Islamics.

I'm not comfortable with terrorists, murderers and blasphemy.

It appears that off the 30 ongoing coflicts, 20 have Islamists as one of the parties.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ongoing_wars

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi..._conflicts.png


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...ldreligion.png

Definitely OK with moderate Muslims, just hate the radicals who bend what their prophet says for their own gain.