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-   -   Differences between German and American submarine life and combat (https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=122930)

FIREWALL 10-20-07 08:19 PM
Fleet boat secret weapon: Icecream machine.:rotfl: :rotfl:

Torplexed 10-20-07 08:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by FIREWALL
Didn't know GROUCHO MARX was a Submariner :D :rotfl:
You betch yer life. ;) Kept his seegars in tubes one thru two. Harpo, Zeppo,Chico and Gummo in tubes three thru six.

Captain Vlad 10-20-07 10:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Takeda Shingen
According to this logic, the uboat war in the Atlantic, the USN's submarine campaign in the Pacific, the Soviet's guerrilla war on the eastern front, Sherman's March to the Sea, Nathan Bedford Forrest's cavalry raiders and the minutemen of the American Revolution are all directly comparable, for they all sought the same ends: Disruption of the enemy's supply.
USN: Unrestricted submarine warfare campaign targetting enemy merchant shipping from 1941-1945.

Kriegsmarine: Unrestricted submarine warfare campaign targetting enemy merchant shipping from 1939-1945.

Takeda Shingen 10-21-07 07:14 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Vlad
USN: Unrestricted submarine warfare campaign targetting enemy merchant shipping from 1941-1945.

Kriegsmarine: Unrestricted submarine warfare campaign targetting enemy merchant shipping from 1939-1945.
Nathan Bedford Forrest: Unrestricted guerrilla warfare targeting enemy supply lines from 1861-1865.

Red Army Militia: Unrestricted guerrilla warfare targeting enemy supply lines from 1941-1943.

All four use the same cycle of ambush and displacement. All four involve use lightly armed units designed for stealth and escape. All four primarily engage soft targets. All four are now directly comparable.

Let the discussion open.

Rockin Robbins 10-21-07 07:52 AM
Supply line tactics:
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Takeda Shingen
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Vlad
USN: Unrestricted submarine warfare campaign targetting enemy merchant shipping from 1941-1945.

Kriegsmarine: Unrestricted submarine warfare campaign targetting enemy merchant shipping from 1939-1945.
Nathan Bedford Forrest: Unrestricted guerrilla warfare targeting enemy supply lines from 1861-1865.

Red Army Militia: Unrestricted guerrilla warfare targeting enemy supply lines from 1941-1943.

All four use the same cycle of ambush and displacement. All four involve use lightly armed units designed for stealth and escape. All four primarily engage soft targets. All four are now directly comparable.

Let the discussion open.
Nathan Bedford Forrest (1861-1865): Targeted enemy supply lines, nobody around but enemy. War lost because foreign help never materialized, but not because of Forrest. Here the Union side understood what the Germans did not in WWII.

Red Army Militia (1941-1943): Targeted enemy supply lines and soft military targets. No enemy but Germans. War won.

USN Submarines (1941-1945): Targeted enemy supply lines and military targets. Only Japanese shipping to contend with. War won because of submarines.

German U-Boat Atlantic Campaign (1939-1945): Targeted enemy supply lines, but because supplies were shipped on neutral bottoms causes entry of United States into the war. War lost because of American/British/Russian superiority when war with the US could have been avoided, war with Britain could have ended with a treaty and victory would have been possible. War lost because of inappropriate use of submarines.

A 10mm open end wrench is a fine tool. But when you try to use in on a ¾" bolt, it isn't going to accomplish anything good. The Germans not only failed to notice that their tool didn't fit, but persisted in using it until they broke the tool and killed the mechanic.:down:

How's that for discussion? ;)

Takeda Shingen 10-21-07 09:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockin Robbins
Nathan Bedford Forrest (1861-1865): Targeted enemy supply lines, nobody around but enemy. War lost because foreign help never materialized, but not because of Forrest. Here the Union side understood what the Germans did not in WWII.

Red Army Militia (1941-1943): Targeted enemy supply lines and soft military targets. No enemy but Germans. War won.

USN Submarines (1941-1945): Targeted enemy supply lines and military targets. Only Japanese shipping to contend with. War won because of submarines.

German U-Boat Atlantic Campaign (1939-1945): Targeted enemy supply lines, but because supplies were shipped on neutral bottoms causes entry of United States into the war. War lost because of American/British/Russian superiority when war with the US could have been avoided, war with Britain could have ended with a treaty and victory would have been possible. War lost because of inappropriate use of submarines.

A 10mm open end wrench is a fine tool. But when you try to use in on a ¾" bolt, it isn't going to accomplish anything good. The Germans not only failed to notice that their tool didn't fit, but persisted in using it until they broke the tool and killed the mechanic.:down:

How's that for discussion? ;)
Magnificent. Now, can we work in the Battle of Hastings? How does Donitz stack up against Edward the Confessor?

U-96 10-21-07 11:22 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Takeda Shingen
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockin Robbins
Nathan Bedford Forrest (1861-1865): Targeted enemy supply lines, nobody around but enemy. War lost because foreign help never materialized, but not because of Forrest. Here the Union side understood what the Germans did not in WWII.

Red Army Militia (1941-1943): Targeted enemy supply lines and soft military targets. No enemy but Germans. War won.

USN Submarines (1941-1945): Targeted enemy supply lines and military targets. Only Japanese shipping to contend with. War won because of submarines.

German U-Boat Atlantic Campaign (1939-1945): Targeted enemy supply lines, but because supplies were shipped on neutral bottoms causes entry of United States into the war. War lost because of American/British/Russian superiority when war with the US could have been avoided, war with Britain could have ended with a treaty and victory would have been possible. War lost because of inappropriate use of submarines.

A 10mm open end wrench is a fine tool. But when you try to use in on a ¾" bolt, it isn't going to accomplish anything good. The Germans not only failed to notice that their tool didn't fit, but persisted in using it until they broke the tool and killed the mechanic.:down:

How's that for discussion? ;)
Magnificent. Now, can we work in the Battle of Hastings? How does Donitz stack up against Edward the Confessor?
The Battle of Agincourt is much more intrigueing :P

Rockin Robbins 10-21-07 12:14 PM
Battles
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by U-96
Quote:
Originally Posted by Takeda Shingen
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockin Robbins
Nathan Bedford Forrest (1861-1865): Targeted enemy supply lines, nobody around but enemy. War lost because foreign help never materialized, but not because of Forrest. Here the Union side understood what the Germans did not in WWII.

Red Army Militia (1941-1943): Targeted enemy supply lines and soft military targets. No enemy but Germans. War won.

USN Submarines (1941-1945): Targeted enemy supply lines and military targets. Only Japanese shipping to contend with. War won because of submarines.

German U-Boat Atlantic Campaign (1939-1945): Targeted enemy supply lines, but because supplies were shipped on neutral bottoms causes entry of United States into the war. War lost because of American/British/Russian superiority when war with the US could have been avoided, war with Britain could have ended with a treaty and victory would have been possible. War lost because of inappropriate use of submarines.

A 10mm open end wrench is a fine tool. But when you try to use in on a ¾" bolt, it isn't going to accomplish anything good. The Germans not only failed to notice that their tool didn't fit, but persisted in using it until they broke the tool and killed the mechanic.:down:

How's that for discussion? ;)
Magnificent. Now, can we work in the Battle of Hastings? How does Donitz stack up against Edward the Confessor?
The Battle of Agincourt is much more intrigueing :P
No, I would have to disagree with both of you. I would hold up the Battle of the Atlantic as the most complex, most far-reaching, most consequential, most brutal, most protracted and most interesting battle in history. It has more plot twists than a James Bond movie, more great and interesting characters on both sides than the Illiad, more tragedy and triumph than Thermopolae, more sacrifice than Picket's charge at Gettysburg. This was a battle that rendered any possible comparison meaningless in its insignificance.:roll:

Takeda Shingen 10-21-07 12:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockin Robbins
No, I would have to disagree with both of you. I would hold up the Battle of the Atlantic as the most complex, most far-reaching, most consequential, most brutal, most protracted and most interesting battle in history. It has more plot twists than a James Bond movie, more great and interesting characters on both sides than the Illiad, more tragedy and triumph than Thermopolae, more sacrifice than Picket's charge at Gettysburg. This was a battle that rendered any possible comparison meaningless in its insignificance.:roll:
More than the Battle of Badon Hill, where Brave Sir Robin personally wet himself?

Torplexed 10-21-07 12:31 PM
Oh well...at least Agincourt gave us some Shakespeare and the St. Crispin's Day speech. :cool: "We few...we precious few...we Band of Brothers."

http://www.wsu.edu/%7Edelahoyd/shake...nrycrispin.jpg

Rockin Robbins 10-21-07 12:54 PM
Wow!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Takeda Shingen
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockin Robbins
No, I would have to disagree with both of you. I would hold up the Battle of the Atlantic as the most complex, most far-reaching, most consequential, most brutal, most protracted and most interesting battle in history. It has more plot twists than a James Bond movie, more great and interesting characters on both sides than the Illiad, more tragedy and triumph than Thermopolae, more sacrifice than Picket's charge at Gettysburg. This was a battle that rendered any possible comparison meaningless in its insignificance.:roll:
More than the Battle of Badon Hill, where Brave Sir Robin personally wet himself?
I forgot completely about that!!!!!!!!

Bravely bold Sir Robin rode forth from Camelot.
He was not afraid to die, O brave Sir Robin!
He was not at all afraid to be killed in nasty ways,
Brave, brave, brave, brave Sir Robin!

He was not in the least bit scared to be mashed into a pulp,
Or to have his eyes gouged out, and his elbows broken;
To have his kneecaps split, and his body burned away;
And his limbs all hacked and mangled, brave Sir Robin!

His head smashed in and his heart cut out
And his liver removed and his bowels unplugged
And his nostrils raped and his bottom burned off
And his pen--


Brave Sir Robin ran away.
Bravely ran away, away!
When danger reared its ugly head,
He bravely turned his tail and fled.
Yes, brave Sir Robin turned about
And gallantly he chickened out.
Bravely taking to his feet
He beat a very brave retreat,
Bravest of the brave, Sir Robin!


 Look at him bravely running away
He's turning his back and he's running away!

Bravely, bravely running way
He's bravely brave Sir Robin!

You win. I was completely forgetting. No excuse for it, really...:oops:

Captain Vlad 10-21-07 03:28 PM
Quote:
More than the Battle of Badon Hill, where Brave Sir Robin personally wet himself?
Quite comparable to when he nearly stood up to the vicious Chicken of Bristol.

mrbeast 10-21-07 05:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Vlad
Quote:
More than the Battle of Badon Hill, where Brave Sir Robin personally wet himself?
Quite comparable to when he nearly stood up to the vicious Chicken of Bristol.
Or when he nearly fought the Dragon of Angnor!


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