Originally Posted by TLAM Strike (Post 1482934)

Is there any space left in Canada? I feel like moving after that, just to get away from idiots who would publish such garbage in a major newspaper...

Originally Posted by Wolfehunter (Post 1483040)

Naw here they gang taser ya.. till u dead. :o:88):dead:

Originally Posted by Penguin (Post 1482915)

I don't think you can compare some college intitiation rituals with torture. During these rituals you have in mind that the "torture" is limited in duration as well as in it's intensity. As a prisoner you don't have this privilege.
If you are so sure that waterboarding is less intense than your pledge week, I can only recommend to try it out. Just make sure your head is upside down and that you cannot move. If you still say it is no torture after this, then you have my deepest respect.

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve (Post 1482927)

You mention the primary definition while conveniently ignoring secondary definitions one of which is "Extreme anguish of body or mind."

I left it out because extreme anguish of body or mind is AGONY and to use it as a loose definition of torture is misleading.

It instills fear because the subject doesn't know that he's not going to drown. In times of extreme stress the mind loses control and the subject has no real awareness of anything but extreme anguish.

Exactly, the fear it instills or not being sure how far their interrogators go helps.Talking to a military officer my family knows who was there when the war on terror began, he said Muslim terrorists were taught that the US will only go so far when interrogating and they were initially thrown off guard by the use of certain tactics.Not knowing and instilling fear is a great weapon against an enemy.Waterboarding US style is safe because the terrorist is no real danger of dying, just scared as hell as they should be.


And were you at any point convinced you were indeed going to die? Student's have died during hazing, which is why certain practices are no longer allowed. If such treatment is acceptable then why are police forbidden to use the practice of holding a suspect's head underwater until he loses his breath, thus instilling the fear of drowning.

Well I knew I would not die but I will say we endured worse things than being tied down and having water poured on me.The practice is not acceptable by local/state police while interrorgating "normal" criminals and esp citizens.The terrorists are militarized enemies of the United States and do not enjoy the very rights of the citizens they seek to destroy.Perfectly acceptable to use enhanced interrogation techniques on foreign terrorists.

Yes, it is indeed torture.

Again, it's not.Sure it is unpleasant but it is not torture and as proven in the Library Tower plot and prob other situtions which are still classified, it worked.


My argument isn't really with what you believe, in spirit. My argument is with your constant attitude that you know everything. As I've said before, if you know everything you have no room left to learn anything. I'm only trying to make you understand that you could be wrong.

I never claim to know everything but I have an educated opinion on things and express it.I then offer a rebuttle most of the time.Perhaps it comes across as I believe I know everything but I do not.There are issues though that I am convinced I am in no way wrong and this is one of them.

I base this on the fact that waterboarding does not fit the definition of torture.Sure someone could try and argue the loose definition but they are wrong.When people thing torture, they think of how the vietnamnese did POW's like John McCain or how the Japanese did allied pow's during the war not having some water splashed on you and scaring you, essestially that is all it does.



Which is relavent how? Somebody else did something worse, so that makes it okay?

No does not make it okay but was showing that we're not using the form of waterboarding that is actually torture but using an enhanced interrogation technique that is really just a "scare tactic" and one that has proven to work.


And there's that attitude again, and that word again. I'm not whining for anyone, but if you're no better than them then what's the point?

Originally Posted by Bubblehead1980 (Post 1483135)

You know, I think I'll try it out sometime just so I can say tell those who allege torture and show them it isnt.Perhaps a youtube video.Hell I did crazier things in college...

Originally Posted by Bilge_Rat (Post 1482912)

see here (although again with a US twist :D):

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=174395

Originally Posted by nikimcbee (Post 1483439)

...give me pelosi and frank.:hmmm::woot: