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:yeah: YES !! YES !! Great idea !! :up:

^^This.

Frankly, that's a scary idea, given that many russian produced games either never get patched, or never get patched except for the original version in russian. That's if an english version is released at all.
That said, I do think a lot of very interesting non-mainstream games are produced in Russia. I just wish they'd be more consistent in support and more ambitious about selling and supporting english versions.
Too often, an english version is delayed 6 months or more, or is just never released at all, and too often games are released and immediately abandoned without much needed patching.

I hope for a russian/eastern european take on a subsim. They tend to make some pretty good sims from time to time. :yep:

Well, SH3,4 and 5 are eastern european takes on subsims :03:
It's just that the publisher isn't.

Did they change to full world modeling in SOW ?! Cool! Because IL-2 had only limited map areas.

*Sigh* I knew I should've mentioned that I am aware of that. :O:

"So... if you know of a self-financed, independent, experienced developer with oodles of money that has a passion for WW2 Subs then point them out to me, cuz I sure as heck can't find any."

So why did UbiSoft make such a poor job of SHV?

Apart from the graphics!!

The Dredd :arrgh!:

Although I think competition on this genre would only do good, I think Ubisoft Romania has earned a last chance to make up with patches, addons, and the promised content addition that followed the server outages. I think I had many a good time with SHIII, and if they enable me to buy and play SHV anywhere and anytime (in single player mode) without intruding my freedom, I will finally still buy this.

Seems like modders are still on board in sufficient numbers to turn this baby around (assume all the functions and basics required to make the 43-45 part come true are there). So I'll keep watching and hoping for the best.

If it doesn't happen, then I hope someone else will take this genre up...

Just to add something to the thought of 'the future of simulation gaming':

I remember, when I was flying helicopters in FS9 and FSX in a community in the US, named hovercontrol, I met some people who were a combined Operation Flashpoint/Flight Simulator Clan. They played both titles, simulated combined air/ground missions with both games. And they didn't even mind the huge gap they had to jump when switching between both games. What they did with imagination can be done with a great bunch of gifted developers and modders. And it cannot be done with a huge publisher like Ubisoft.

Unite. Please. ;)

Extra, extra, extra. Latest news!
SHV sells one copy in a week at Amazon USA

no, wasn't me! :D

Neal,

What about SES' Jutland, Eagle Dynamics' DCS series, neoqb's ROF, eSim's SBpro, Graviteam's SF: Kharkov 1942, OBD's OFF etc, etc.

There are a lot of small, sometimes self-published developers that can produce very complex (more than SH), and often graphically acceptable (DCS, ROF, SF) sims.

My point, there are a lot of groups who can meet or exceed our expectations. Indeed, as far as fidelity, complexity and accuracy are concerned, SH would be beaten by all of the above. Some can equal it in graphics too.

Yeah, and he's completely right on the money. I happen to be one of those gamers who used to spend hours on Silent Service and Red Storm Rising, but I can't really bother with the current crop of sims because, as Sid says, they're way too complex for my taste. I tried having fun with SH4 but after a while it becomes apparent that the gameplay consists of operating workstations on the sub while performing what is essentially the same kind of approach over and over again and by then the novelty has worn off. Don't even get me started on Sub Command or Dangerous Waters.

If we look at flight sims, they're far from dead. In fact, the Third Wire games are doing pretty damned well and they're 'lite' sims. If there was such a thing as a 'lite' nuke subsim I'd buy it in a heartbeat.

Problem with some of the beforementioned studios is, that the studios are not game studios in the first place. Take DCS or ArmA for example. These publishers are mainly doing titles which sell pretty well to special customers like armies of real states. With these titles, it was luckily the case that the professional (as in 'serious') sim also had some parallels and quite a big market in the gaming sector, so a slightly different and a more or less simple version was released as a pc game.

Many publishers do not have the background of commercial 'serious' sims, which is a background that provides a lot of freedom to them in terms of funding.