| Ducimus |
01-25-10 05:04 AM |
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry708
(Post 1244845)
I am sure some will take this the wrong way but I have a question, what’s the fascination with U-boats anyway. :hmmm: SH 2, SH 3 and SH 4 the U-boat add-on and now SH 5 all with U-boats. I know the U-boat was considered the best boat at the time by some, but really why does everyone like playing on the ‘Loosing Side’. By the end of 1943 the U-boats were nothing but an Iron Coffin with maybe a 20% chance of getting home again.
IMHO of course.
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Well, some people KNEW this topic would eventually draw a response from me. :O:
In my own words from a post a couple months ago:
For whatever reason, Uboats are probably one of the most, if not the most romanticized elements of WW2. The uboat story has been told and retold to such a degree, they've been stripped of most historical context, become completely neutral and sterile, laminated with western ideals and ideology, thought of morally as the shining knights of the sea, placed upon a pedestal and worshiped as Hero's, and lamented as the unfortunate martyrs in the tragedy that is war.
The movie Das Boot, and the Novel Iron Coffins, has a HUGE role in that here. Both book and movie are often taken at face value as the gospel truth by many here. Which leads me to another point. Something that's bound to cause a stir, It's something that was posted in private because the author was worried about a backlash. So I will not say who the author of this post is, and i know reposting it is not going to make me any friends (as if i've ever worried about that :haha: ), but it's such an awesome post on the subject, i can't resist:
Quote:
As I have written before , I enjoy studying both theaters of the submarine wars. I have mutual respect for the both sides though I do acknowledge, unlike the fanboys, that there were dedicated Nazis within the u-boat arm. And that fact starts at the top, with Herr Dönitz...he did become the second Führer after all.
I have had the honor of corresponding with and talking with many u-boat veterans...some that are famous and others that are not. I was driven to at first to gain autographs from these men from history. I wanted to be able to ask hard questions and get a deeper understanding of the war from their point of view and to connect with those that I had only read about. To get a human side of a big part of the war. I am very grateful for their friendship and assistance. They opened my eyes to things I would never have understood otherwise.
To a man, they are all very glad that their Fatherland, Germany, lost the war. They speak fondly of their days in the service as most veterans do. The less famous u-boat veterans also feel honored to be remembered by someone such as myself who took the time and effort to locate their address and drop them a letter inquiring about their experiences. Those that are famous received literally hundreds of letters a weeks from folks.
I must say that these veterans don't think highly of Herbert Werner or Lothar-Günther Buchheim. Werner wrote his book in the late 1960s and was received with critical success. It became a bestseller world-wide for the frankness and anti-Nazi sentiments. Btw, the 1960s were the beginnings of apologist histories regarding the Nazi state. It is a fascinating memoir to read...and I use the word "memoir" loosely. The esteemed naval historian Dr. Jürgen Rohwer studied the memoir and compared its claims to facts. Many of the instances Werner claims were personal experiences were actually borrowed from other people. Rohwer stated that if the factual errors were highlighted in red the book would "read as a bloodbath."
The success of Werner's Iron Coffins was not lost on Buchheim. Buchheim realized that the world might be ready for a novel of his 'experiences' on a u-boat...provided he add in the required anti-Nazi spin. It is a fine book and I have read it many times, but I am aware of the time and reason for its creation. Money. Nothing more...nothing less. Reinhard Hardegen has spoken bluntly about his dislike of Buchheim. In a nutshell, he states that Buchheim 'has only one god and it is money.' Hardegen also took strong objections to the wild party at the brothel before a patrol, the crew pissing on their captain, and the gun-incident where the captain has to keep his chief maschinist in check. None of these ever happened. Hardegen states that if a captain had to produce a pistol, then the situation was far beyond getting control. The respect towards Der Alte was too great for these things to happen.
Erich Topp said that I should look at Das Boot as factual with the boredom depicted...and then the excitement of action. But forget the rest. Karl-Friedrich Merten had a long standing feud with Buchheim towards his defining opus. The u-bootfarhrer organizations disowned both Werner and Buchheim. (Trust me, Werner is a cocky s.o.b. considering he didn't do anything as a skipper except survive.)
For more detailed study of the German u-boat in popular culture, read Michael Hadley's Count Not the Dead.
And for the claim of the u-boat arm being Nazi-free, that is something that can never be proven. Timothy Mulligan did a fine study on u-boat men in Neither Sharks nor Wolves. He dedicated a chapter 'proving' that the u-boat men weren't Nazis. Never mind the fact that once Dönitz succeeded Raeder as CinC of the Kriegsmarine the Nazi salute soon became the official salute. Yeah, I know some would say big whoopdee-doo.
Here's the fact that Mulligan nor anyone else has been able to explain away. Millions joined the Nazi party in the 1930s (mandated by law or whatever). Out of those, a vast major believed in the basic tenets of National Socialism. Most of the party members were those skilled laborers that eventually became the backbone of the u-boat arm....machinists, mechanics, etc.
Those that enlisted were required (by Admiral Raeder) to resign their membership in the National Socialist party thereby creating a "Nazi-free" Kriegsmarine. But here's the problem...they may have resigned their membership, but did they truly resign their belief in the ideology of the Nazi party? I say no. There are ample cases of those with definite Nazi leanings within the u-boat service (Wolfgang Lüth, Joachim Schepke, Ulrich Abel and his vilification of Oskar Kusch who was eventually executed for statements against the party, Günther Prien, etc.)
For years, u-boat enthusiasts have paid no attention to "the men behind the curtain" but once you strip away the romantiscm, you are left staring at a grim reality...a reality that isn't as nice to cuddle up with.
I'll conclude this long-winded post with an anecdote told to me by Erich Topp on a phone call I had with him in 2000. Herrn Topp told me about a train ride he had with publisher Ted Savas. He told me that the train was moving along through night and it was quiet. Mr. Savas noticed that Topp seemed rather pensive and asked if he could know what he was thinking. Topp leaned forward and said that he was thinking that after Topp was dead, he would only be remembered for one thing. And it bothered him deeply that none of his post-war accomplishments would be remembered. Only the ugly parts.
And it turns out, at least at SubSsim, he was right.
I search for truth...not things that prop up what I believe/want to be true. I have to admit that it was difficult to let the myths go, but I have a better understanding of the u-boat war now than I did then.
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I probably just set myself up for crucifiiction, but.. meh, won't be the first time. :yawn: |
