The product was meant to be SC patched to 1.08.It wasn't done properly and that is why it doesn't work.SCS did this work and released it as part of the NCP.
I have SC patched by myself to1.08 and SCu works just fine.They FXXXXd it up!!!

Try establishing antecedents once in awhile. If you're saying that the NCP version of Sub Command doesn't work when properly installed, and if that's true, then yeah, SCS ****ed it up. But if you're saying that a mod built for the pre-NCP version (and probably pre-Windows ME, to take a guess at why there might be compatibility issues between versions) doesn't work with the NCP version, to argue that means that SCS ****ed up is just absoutely out of touch with reality. It's absolute nonsense to think that SCS has some duty to make its products compatible with another party's mods.

As ML has stated clearly, SCU is a mod (and an unauthorized illegal one at that which just is tolerated by SCS) and the creators of said mod would have to modify it to get it to work with the NCP-SC. The reason why this mod doesnt work with the NCP-SC is that the new .exe file has some changes in it (to work better under XP) and because of this is differently named. Therefore the SCU installer wont recognize it as a proper 1.08 SC.exe

SCS did what it said with the NCP, they fixed all the products in it so they work well with XP. Unfortunatly this meant that one illegal modification based on reverse engineering of copyright protected code wont work properly anymore.

Guess you are right and SCS really is to blame here ... they should really get back to the drawing board, fix that offensive file so we can use that illegal modification properly.



P.S. : In case anyone didn't get my sarcastic intention on that last sentence I want to spill it out clearly ... that last sentence is pure sarcasm!

EDIT : Just saw that ML posted faster then myself ... still ...

Just to clarify i have both versions of SC the origional one released when it first came out and also the NCP.

Now when i install the NCP its ready patched to 108 i just install SCX to it however it doesnt like it and i get no sound.

The older version i have to manually install the patchs and also SCX but works just fine.

I run XP.

I have always run xp and i have the same problem as Kap.
One shot you seem very one sided in all this.Is it because you run the forum for Sonalysts?If Scu is illegal why do many offer it openly as a mod and why hasn't SCS prosecuted them??
Part of the reason the NCP didn't sell was that it will not run SCu properly.You will see many posts on the SC forum with people querying this.

Back on the original topic, a friend of mine who is actually working on the Astute was telling me quite a few revealing things about problems they are having with it. He said that when they announced it would be submerged for the first time this week, most of the workers were 'crapping themselves' (his words), as he said that it is 'literally being thrown together' (again his words), in order to meet the schedule being demanded of them.

At its heart, he said the problem was the ridiculous Health and Safety regulations the workers are asked to follow, one being that they had to have safety harnesses while on the gantries working on it (fair enough), but the way they were implemented, there was no way to release your harness when you wanted to come down to a lower level for example, as a result, they were told to not bother using them but not to say anything. This is because all the palaver they were having was slowing things down, which is why it was being thrown together, at one point work was stopped because their high visibility jackets were the wrong colour, which contravened the H&S rules!

He also remarked that the workers were not happy about producing something that sloppily, as it is supposed to last for years, but there is little they can do, because of the impossible situation in which they are placed with an unmeetable schedule when following the rules, and he claims that the RN will have problems with it, somewhere down the line because of the poor quality control.

Doesn't seem very 'Astute' to me!

:D Chock

@Linton : My statements may seem onesided tho in general I try to display both sides of a particular coin (Feel free to browse through all my posts in this as well as other forums).

As far as this thread and mostly your statements go ... simply going by all the relevant facts leads to the stuff I write and weird as that may be, my being a Mod over at the SCS Forum has nothing to do with that. ML basically says the same as me (as do some others) so either we are all biased big time or have some other (more meaningful) reason to say what we say.

And yes, SCU is illegal (this statement is based on the EULA of SC as well as comments by SCS Officials over the time). However, after SCU was released SCS has chosen not to prosecute anyone having a hand in the development or sharing of it. Let me repeat this for clarity ... they choose not to prosecute, albeit they had all the right to do so.

As for the reason of the NCP selling good or bad ... your guess is as good as anyones, but the prudent way to go would be stating guesses as guesses and not as facts.

I have read my EULA for SC and nowhere does it say that it cannot be modded.This is the version released in the UK by EA games.
I believe that ML was a beta tester for DW so you can hardly call him independent of SCS.
You still have not answered why SCS do not want DW modded but have basically turned a blind eye to SCu/SCX.They have turned their back on gaming so why not leave it to the community to mod it for our own use and amusement?I cannot see anybody selling a modified version to a big customer.
As someone with associations to SCS Oneshot, perhaps you could tell me who I should be posting these questions to in the company.
Our resident chap seems to have gone on patrol!

All of the above is good discussion, but bottom line is Sonalysts have explicitely reserved the sole right to make new playables for DW. Subsim is legally and morally bound to honor their request. Should anyone post a link to a new playable for DW, I'll be forced to delete it and lock this thread.

Seriously, folks. Sonalysts spent blood and treasure bringing DW to market. Sales were disappointing. If the community were to create new playables (as was done with Sub Command), it would make an official expansion or follow-on to DW less attractive from a business point-of-view, and ultimately harm the community.

:|\\

Apart from all the legal implications, can I ask a more practical question - why does it have to be DW? It is not completely unfair to say that DW is SC with skimmers added. The discussion appears to be about adding a sub -then why not add it to SC instead? SCS have chosen to permit, or at least not challenge, additional playable platforms in SC, so why not create the add-on for SC and avoid direct confrontation with a very creative company who should be encouraged to produce more excellent sims for us all to enjoy?

Good explanation Bill.I will revisit this topic in a year's time to see if anything has happened from SCS to improve the game.If they have then I will owe you all an apology,but by then we will all probably be talking about SH5-The Cold War.

Because notwithstanding the limitations in terms of drivable units in DW, this game is still superior to SC (in my opinion).
Its a step foreward, and even though I have the NCP guess which game I play regularly ?
LWAMI is doing a very good job "fixing" DW and I think TLAM Strike is importing into the LWAMI database a very good portion of SCX 3D models.
When all this is done, the real modding of DW will begin extending the database to include new navies, new weapons, etc.. a new advanced model fort torpedoes and more....
So I don't think DW is dead with the community, testament to this is the games that are being played regularly over the web.
To be honest I think that only a vocal minority is still pushing the issue of having an SCU type mod for DW.

Clive,an excellent post.The SC forum used to be very busy when I first joined.DW came along with much promise and the posters and modders melted away.Perhaps SC should be the focus of future modding as most of us are Subsimmers at heart.
Could a further development of SCX take place?

Well, I have recently added a few new playables to SC outside of SCX - see the relevant forum for download links. When I get a minute I could take a look at having a go at the Astute...not DW, but better than nothing...

Thats why I said ... as do some others ...

I don't know why they didn't come down on the guys who made SCU, tho I'm sure someone from the SCX Team is able to enlighten us. As for the reason why they don't want community made new playables for DW ... try searching in these forums as well as the FAQ or the interview with Jamie in regard to DW. I'd say the answer is out there and easy to find.

For you as well as everybody else including myself ... the point of contact is Frying Tiger.

On a sidenote, any statement in regard to the future of DW is pure speculation at this time and therefore anybodys guess. The last official word from SCS on DW in regard to its future, patches, expansions/addons and whatnot was, and until someone says otherwise still is, that they have not decided on anything in regard to the future of the Commercial version at this time.