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-   -   FSAA/Anti-aliasing/Major resolution problem (merged) (https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=106588)

Akula 03-22-07 09:01 AM

I am really happy about a new subsim as they are far and few in between.

I have to agree though that it is a dissapointment that it does look so bad at higher resolutions or that the higher resolution and AA doesn't really work and only hope that there will be a fix for it soon.

Thanks,
Gian

Deep Six 03-22-07 09:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Potoroo
Quote:

Originally Posted by Deep Six
Quick question for those who have a 8800 card has anyone tried using nHancer and tried forcing AA thru this utility?. I use it and it can in most cases get "around" the fact that some games have no AA.....

As I reported a couple of pages ago I am unable to force AA on SH4 via an Nvidia application profile as I can do with SH3. I use nHancer. That my card is a 7800GT rather than an 8 series is irrelevant.

Well I'm sad to say after just receiving my deluxe edition..I'm totally let down by this game....I have tried EVERYTHING under the sun to get AA working ..The best program for me has always been nHancer..Even that cannot override the the games default limitations. I have a bleeding edge 8800GTX ACs3 Super-clocked card.....This is Shameless on Ubi and the dev side...This is HOW not too promote your game guys....This is 2007 shessh at least let US decide at what Reso and AA WE think the games runs best at....

My God this is a FUGLY game....I hope the GAMEPLAY is better or I'm NOT even going to play this game untill the mods start to improve a disastrous beginning to what SHOULD have been UBI premier SUB GAME...

I just feel so let down.....

stabiz 03-22-07 09:48 AM

I have it too now, and it actually looks worse in real life than in shots. It looks like there is some grainy filter running, escpecially easy to see when you are inside the boat.

DragonRR1 03-22-07 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stabiz
I have it too now, and it actually looks worse in real life than in shots. It looks like there is some grainy filter running, escpecially easy to see when you are inside the boat.

Try turning off post processing, if you haven't already, and check again.

Bo-Bo 03-22-07 10:51 AM

System spec's in my sig......I'm having the same issue and feel let down/cheated. I really hope this gets addressed soon but in looking through the 1.1patch readme I'm not very hopefull. There sure are a lot of "Added" and very few "Fixed".

One should NOT have to downgrade to have a decent looking game.

DragonRR1 03-22-07 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DragonRR1
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mikkow
I have the game (1.0) now in Sweden. I can say with certainty that, even in 1024x768, this is not the rendered resolution when looking through binoculars. I took screens and compared, etc. It's more like 640x480 being upsampled (after the scene was rendered) with some basic smoothing applied (bicubic or bilinear).

It looks very similar to console/TV intended rendering.
The effect is very easily seen when looking at anything through binoculars.

Well that isn't exactly great news :(

I have always said approximately 1024x768 although I did check the pixel width on jagged edges and it appears to be roughy 2:1 at 1920x1200 which would suggest 800x600 - 1024x768. 640x480 would be 3:1 horizontal and 2.51 vertical. It didn't seem quite that bad to me.

When I've been searching for the fixed resolution in the files I've always looked for standard ways of storing 1024x768 (0400 x 0300 in hex) and have had no luck finding anything obvious. I suppose it is possible that the reason why I haven't found anything is because I've been searching for the wrong thing!

Well I'm running the new patch now and imo.. if anything the binocular view (when zoomed in) and the periscope view *seem* to be at the full resolution. Unfortunately because of the software aliasing, or whatever it is, things still have a pixellated look. I'm really not sure whether this was the case in 1.0 or not. The way I'm checking this is by taking a screenshot and zooming into a pixel stepped area and checking whether the steps, horizontal and vertical, are more than a single pixel. With the periscope and binoculars they don't seem to be.

I guess, if I'm right, the good news will be that changing the bridge and external views to full resolution will be a doddle! Assuming, of course, that UBI choose to do this.

Edit:
[img=http://img252.imageshack.us/img252/19/102411sq0.th.gif]

This is a 1024x768 screen from the bridge which appears to have 1:1 pixel mapping.

rdtwendt 03-22-07 02:25 PM

I will be avoiding SH4 indefinetely, until this issue is addressed by a mod or an official response. :down:

It's hard for me to come to terms with such a drastic decision, but being the graphics snob that I am I have to draw a line in the sand. I understand that some will view this as extreme but I feel strongly that there is no excuse for a major game release like SH4, which was advertised and touted to have amazing graphics, to be without support for FSAA or true resolution switching, and certainly not without both. :nope:

Having already purchased the game, and thereby contributed to the subsim genre and its future, I feel rather cheated. I loved SH3 and learned to cope with the lower 1024x768 resolution, in comparison to the 1920x1200 native resolution that my monitor so eagly desires, because of the ability to enable AA and AF. The current inability to do this in SH4 is a showstopper, and will force me to find virtual refuge elsewhere until something can be done. I just can't allow my 8800gtx to render the garbage that SH4 is currently pushing. The game appears as if it would indeed live up to it's billing as graphically impressive if FSAA actually worked as it did in SH3 or if it actually ran the 3d textures in the 1920x1200 I've selected. Until this is fixed, I will leave you gentlemen with wishes for fair weather and good hunting.
:cry:


navec 03-22-07 02:52 PM

Does anyone else remember the devs talking about SHIV's greatly improved graphics? I do. On ubi's forums they are still claiming that DX10 might be supported in a future patch. Is that some sort of private joke among the developers? If their crack team is baffled by the cutting-edge technologies of multiple resolutions and anti-aliasing, then they might want to rethink their dx10 plans.

Elder-Pirate 03-22-07 02:55 PM

Feet ? FEET ! All right, horay.
 
I noticed in DragonRR1's post ( #563 ) this pic [img=http://img252.imageshack.us/img252/19/102411sq0.th.gif] has "16 ft" bottom right hand corner by depth gauge. YAAAY. :rock:

DragonRR1 03-22-07 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elder-Pirate
I noticed in DragonRR1's post ( #563 ) this pic [img=http://img252.imageshack.us/img252/19/102411sq0.th.gif] has "16 ft" bottom right hand corner by depth gauge. YAAAY. :rock:

Do I detect a note of sarcasm in your post? :lol:

Elder-Pirate 03-22-07 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DragonRR1
Quote:

Originally Posted by Elder-Pirate
I noticed in DragonRR1's post ( #563 ) this pic [img=http://img252.imageshack.us/img252/19/102411sq0.th.gif] has "16 ft" bottom right hand corner by depth gauge. YAAAY. :rock:

Do I detect a note of sarcasm in your post? :lol:


Heh heh. :smug:

nhall70 03-22-07 10:41 PM

Ok Guys,

I'm going to take a crack at putting this whole 1024x768 upscale thing to bed. I went ahead and bought the game so I could see this problem first hand on my 24" monitor and figure out what's going on here. I love the quest for truth! :)

Bottom line (for those who don't want the details)...I believe that the resolution is true. If you set it to 1920x1200, you get a 3D rendered scene that is 1920x1200 resolution. I am certain that the image is NOT being upscaled.

I think there are a few things that are leading people to believe that the image is being upscaled.

1) There is no FSAA available. Many of us are accustomed to using FSAA pretty much all the time. I think this is the first time I've ever seen an image on my 24" monitor that wasn't anti-aliased. It's umm...an adjustment. :roll:

2) Many of the reports of poor resolution are coming from people with larger monitors. When considering resolution, one must also consider the pixel pitch of the display. 1920x1200 is basically the widescreen equivalent of 1600x1200...no better, no worse. But on a 24" monitor, the pixels are larger than on a 20" display running at 1600x1200. If you want high image quality on a large monitor, you simply must have FSAA, period.

3) The triangle count on the models in SH4 is quite high...almost too high for a scene that's not using FSAA. 3D geometry is being used in places that might better be done with just texturing alone if you're not going to support FSAA. Textures filter more smoothly than geometry, unless of course FSAA is being used...and in this case it's not. High triangle counts and more geometry are great, but only when FSAA is available. More geometry creates more edges which results in more aliasing (or jaggies if you prefer).

So, when you combine all of these factors together...large monitor, user that is accustomed to FSAA, extremely high triangle counts, etc...it's easy to see how someone might think there's something wrong.

However, I believe the resolution is correct. Now this doesn't mean that I think SH4 looks as good as it could...it has the problems it has. But I don't think Ubi is pulling a fast one on the resolution thing.

Just my thoughts.

Ark 03-22-07 10:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nhall70
Ok Guys,

I'm going to take a crack at putting this whole 1024x768 upscale thing to bed. I went ahead and bought the game so I could see this problem first hand on my 24" monitor and figure out what's going on here. I love the quest for truth! :)

Bottom line (for those who don't want the details)...I believe that the resolution is true. If you set it to 1920x1200, you get a 3D rendered scene that is 1920x1200 resolution. I am certain that the image is NOT being upscaled.

I think there are a few things that are leading people to believe that the image is being upscaled.

1) There is no FSAA available. Many of us are accustomed to using FSAA pretty much all the time. I think this is the first time I've ever seen an image on my 24" monitor that wasn't anti-aliased. It's umm...an adjustment. :roll:

2) Many of the reports of poor resolution are coming from people with larger monitors. When considering resolution, one must also consider the pixel pitch of the display. 1920x1200 is basically the widescreen equivalent of 1600x1200...no better, no worse. But on a 24" monitor, the pixels are larger than on a 20" display running at 1600x1200. If you want high image quality on a large monitor, you simply must have FSAA, period.

3) The triangle count on the models in SH4 is quite high...almost too high for a scene that's not using FSAA. 3D geometry is being used in places that might better be done with just texturing alone if you're not going to support FSAA. Textures filter more smoothly than geometry, unless of course FSAA is being used...and in this case it's not. High triangle counts and more geometry are great, but only when FSAA is available. More geometry creates more edges which results in more aliasing (or jaggies if you prefer).

So, when you combine all of these factors together...large monitor, user that is accustomed to FSAA, extremely high triangle counts, etc...it's easy to see how someone might think there's something wrong.

However, I believe the resolution is correct. Now this doesn't mean that I think SH4 looks as good as it could...it has the problems it has. But I don't think Ubi is pulling a fast one on the resolution thing.

Just my thoughts.

I would have to disagree.

I run 1600x1200 on my 21 inch CRT. If I switch to 1920x1200, the image looks the exact same...the only difference being the GUI. Same jaggies. Going even higher in resolution produces the same result.

There should be very few jaggies at a 2000+ resolution on my CRT.....but the image looks the exact same. In fact, I don't think there should be that many aliasing issues at all at a resolution of 2048x1536. There aren't that many in R6:Vegas at that resolution, but in SHIV, it still looks the same. Run Lock On at 2048x1536 and it's soemwhat difficult to find jaggies without FSAA. They are still present, but nowhere near the same as 1024x768.

My monitor size is staying the same, so that dispells your theory. :(

XanderF 03-22-07 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nhall70
Ok Guys,

I'm going to take a crack at putting this whole 1024x768 upscale thing to bed. I went ahead and bought the game so I could see this problem first hand on my 24" monitor and figure out what's going on here. I love the quest for truth! :)

Ummm...yeah, as was pointed out earlier in the thread (and can proven with screenshots), it's easy to prove the res is locked.

Make sure the below test is a screenshot with 2d and 3d elements - say, a view from the bridge with the gauges on screen.

Fire up Silent Hunter 3 with the res patch. Take a screenshot at 800x600, then use Photoshop to resize up to 1600x1200. Now, run the game at 1600x1200, take a screenshot. Compare them - no FSAA or anything. Note how different they are.

Now, fire up Silent Hunter 4. Take a screenshot at 800x600, then use Photoshop to resize up to 1600x1200. Now, run it at 1600x1200, take a screenshot. Compare them - no FSAA or anything. Note how IDENTICAL they are - especially how the gauges are quite different, but the '3d world' is identical!

Guido 03-23-07 03:09 AM

yup, im with my fellow americans on this one.

It stays the same, my crew look like giants on my sony bravia!


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