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-   -   [WIP] IRAI (Intelligent Random AI) (https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=171973)

Krauter 08-14-10 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antar (Post 1468065)
Now your IRAI is too hard for middle-level gamers, but is perfect for 100% hard maniacs... Maybe I'm wrong but I think that if somebody tell you that your mod (or SH5) has stupid AI, you should answer: wow, man, tell me first whit difficulty level do you use...
:yawn:

I don't consider myself a 100% hard Maniac (I play 77%..) and this Mod is what I'm looking for

Capt Jack Harkness 08-14-10 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDarkWraith (Post 1468040)
I'm assuming so from when I was in the Navy the ship's in our battlegroup did. If someone can get the historic actual values for all the different hydrophones used I'll make them historically accurate.

http://www.uboat.net/allies/technical/asdic.htm

It appears that the ASDIC system could double as a hydrophone, and I've found no record of dedicated hydrophones on RN destroyers. If this is true, then I would imagine hydrophone coverage would be identical to ASDIC coverage. Perhaps they listened while cruising, then pinged when there was certain evidence of a sub in the area? Either way it would mean that hydrophones and ASDIC cannot be used simultaneously.

Is it possible to make the sensor effectiveness of both a proportion of speed? The article said ASDIC was nearly useless above 18 kts, other sources say 15 kts.

TheDarkWraith 08-14-10 04:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Capt Jack Harkness (Post 1468080)
http://www.uboat.net/allies/technical/asdic.htmIs it possible to make the sensor effectiveness of both a proportion of speed? The article said ASDIC was nearly useless above 18 kts, other sources say 15 kts.

speed already plays a role in sensor effectiveness of hydrophone and sonar.

Krauter 08-14-10 04:41 PM

Even today it is a factor in Modern SSN, SSB(G)Ns and Destroyers/Frigates

TheDarkWraith 08-14-10 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 303_Michcich (Post 1468076)
...and that I guess depends on sea state - i.e. less likely to detect when wavy conditions etc. ?

I guess I now need to retract scope between taking readings

waves have a part in the sensor effectiveness of visual, hydrophone, and sonar.

Tested the full 360 hydrophone sweep and didn't like the results. It was too easy to 'baffle' ride. So I changed it:

- adjusted ship AI hydrophone to full 360 degree sweep. From 90-135 the sensitivity is 0.85, from 135-157 the sensitivity is 0.7, from 157-169 the sensitivity is 0.55, from 169-191 the sensitivity is 0.3 (to account for propeller noise and engine noise), from 191-203 the sensitivity is 0.55, from 203-225 the sensitivity is 0.7, and from 225 to 270 the sensitivity is 0.85, and from 270-90 the sensitivity is defined by the sim.cfg file (currently 1.0)

Now you can still 'baffle ride' but you have a very narrow range (22 degrees) to stay inside of. Stray outside of that and chances of getting detected rise considerably.

TheDarkWraith 08-14-10 06:51 PM

v0.0.16 released. See post #1 for details :|\\

TheDarkWraith 08-14-10 07:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antar (Post 1468065)
current sensor = sensors.cfg * current difficulty level

Now your IRAI is too hard for middle-level gamers, but is perfect for 100% hard maniacs... Maybe I'm wrong but I think that if somebody tell you that your mod (or SH5) has stupid AI, you should answer: wow, man, tell me first whit difficulty level do you use...
:yawn:

I have an idea of how the user can change the difficulty they want for this mod (in a range of 0-1 with 1 being 100% difficulty). I'll try and implement it tomorrow :yep:

EDIT:

just gave it a quick look and my idea will work. The user will be able to set the difficulty level they want for the following AI sensors for ships only:

- visual
- hydrophone
- radar
- sonar

Each sensor will have a difficulty rating of 0.0 - 1.0 with 0 being doesn't exist to 1 being 100% difficulty (current state of mod).

PL_Andrev 08-15-10 02:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDarkWraith (Post 1468177)
Each sensor will have a difficulty rating of 0.0 - 1.0 with 0 being doesn't exist to 1 being 100% difficulty (current state of mod).

I think about in at night and change the conception of difficulty level:
You have 4 difficulty levels for game (difficulty rating):
low (25%), medium (50%), hard (75%), real (100%)
But only this difficulty level change value of sensors.

No other issues (dud torpedoes, manual targeting, stabilize view) take you 20%. So, hard AI level with all issues gives 75%, without = 75-20 = 55%. New player will can try use 100% hard game (manual targeting, dud torpedoes, limit of air) with easy level of AI.
The question about CUSTOM level (difficulty level depend from original settings?).

And repaired automatic/manual targeting.

What do you think?

tonschk 08-15-10 03:40 AM

:DL Thank you TheDarkWraith :yeah:

TheDarkWraith 08-15-10 04:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antar (Post 1468308)
I think about in at night and change the conception of difficulty level:
You have 4 difficulty levels for game (difficulty rating):
low (25%), medium (50%), hard (75%), real (100%)
But only this difficulty level change value of sensors.

No other issues (dud torpedoes, manual targeting, stabilize view) take you 20%. So, hard AI level with all issues gives 75%, without = 75-20 = 55%. New player will can try use 100% hard game (manual targeting, dud torpedoes, limit of air) with easy level of AI.
The question about CUSTOM level (difficulty level depend from original settings?).

And repaired automatic/manual targeting.

What do you think?

not quite following you here. Are you saying to make something where one chooses the difficulty level they want for the AI based on 4 levels? If so, can't be implemented. The way I have to implement any kind of difficulty level will involve the user editing the init.aix file. Only way I've found to make this work so far.

PL_Andrev 08-15-10 06:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDarkWraith (Post 1436291)
IRAI ver. 0.0.16
- adjust sub crew AI's sweep time from 30 to 5 and sweep arc from 16 to 20 to give faster updates on hydrophone contacts
- adjusted sub crew AI's RPM detection level from 0.25 to 0.075 (crew will be able to detect slow moving contacts now)

Is this corresponding with Sober's hydrophone fix?
Sober used EPCGE file but this is no overwrited by IRAI...
:hmmm:

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDarkWraith (Post 1436291)
- adjusted the ability of ships to damage themselves from depth charges by changing the minimum depth they are allowed to release DCs

I do not understand...
The minimal depth attack by DC is corresponding with escort speed?
______________________

Stock bug spotted (tested no mods/IRAI):
On some escort ships hydro is not working (I attacked this convoy at full submerged speed (historic mission/Pedestal)
1.
Escorts on convoy with no hydro, other task force escorts have it:
http://img227.imageshack.us/img227/6960/hydro1.png

2.
After AI antisubmarine support this same story:
http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/4708/hydro2.png

303_Michcich 08-15-10 06:34 AM

TDW,

As I cannot really use the manual targeting method using (ship lenght/time in seconds) *1,94 = speed in Kts as the ships do not seems to keep steady speed but varying speed (navigator is giving for example: speed 13 knots, avg speed 12 kts and couple of moments later speed 8 Kts, avg speed: 7kts), can you recommend what the best way of fully manual targetting is using IRAI ?

As said, I had not probelms hitting ships before IRAI on full real manual using method described in this thread: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=164917

Also, thanks for coming up scalable difficulty idea !
mc

303_Michcich 08-15-10 07:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 303_Michcich (Post 1468372)
TDW,

As I cannot really use the manual targeting method using (ship lenght/time in seconds) *1,94 = speed in Kts as the ships do not seems to keep steady speed but varying speed (navigator is giving for example: speed 13 knots, avg speed 12 kts and couple of moments later speed 8 Kts, avg speed: 7kts), can you recommend what the best way of fully manual targetting is using IRAI ?

As said, I had not probelms hitting ships before IRAI on full real manual using method described in this thread: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=164917

Also, thanks for coming up scalable difficulty idea !
mc

TDW, sorry to be a pest, but... :) I have tested the manual tutorial mission by emtguf contained in the thread quoted above - there is single ship in distance of 4,000 m going towards my sub - I dived to persicope depth, all stop, no scopes and....the ship starts zigazagin at about 3,000 m from my sub - why is that ? they can`t see me, can they ? they can`t hear me as it`s all stop !

P.S. weather conditions in this mission are perfect, mid-day, sunny, all clear...

TheDarkWraith 08-15-10 07:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 303_Michcich (Post 1468394)
TDW, sorry to be a pest, but... :) I have tested the manual tutorial mission by emtguf contained in the thread quoted above - there is single ship in distance of 4,000 m going towards my sub - I dived to persicope depth, all stop, no scopes and....the ship starts zigazagin at about 3,000 m from my sub - why is that ? they can`t see me, can they ? they can`t hear me as it`s all stop !

P.S. weather conditions in this mission are perfect, mid-day, sunny, all clear...

I'll have to run that single mission and see what's going on.

Happy to report my idea of how to implement difficulty in the ship AI works beautifully! You can change the difficulty of the visual, hydrophone, sonar, and radar by adjusting the values in \data\Scripts\AI\init.aix (can be opened with Notepad). Look for this section at top of file:

###################### Difficulty parameters ####################
# Note: difficulty is in range 0.0 - 1.0 with 0.0 being no difficulty (sensor doesn't exist)
VISUAL_DIFFICULTY = 1.0;
HYDROPHONE_DIFFICULTY = 1.0;
RADAR_DIFFICULTY = 1.0;
SONAR_DIFFICULTY = 1.0;

303_Michcich 08-15-10 08:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 303_Michcich (Post 1468372)
TDW,

As I cannot really use the manual targeting method using (ship lenght/time in seconds) *1,94 = speed in Kts as the ships do not seems to keep steady speed but varying speed (navigator is giving for example: speed 13 knots, avg speed 12 kts and couple of moments later speed 8 Kts, avg speed: 7kts), can you recommend what the best way of fully manual targetting is using IRAI ?

As said, I had not probelms hitting ships before IRAI on full real manual using method described in this thread: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=164917

Also, thanks for coming up scalable difficulty idea !
mc

fantastic- thanks ! will test it asap. this refers to ship ai difficulty and NOT the escorts, right ?

Sorry, just downloaded 0.16 again, but difficulty settings seem not implemented yet ?


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