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-   -   International sanctions ended on Iran (https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=223839)

August 01-20-16 11:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Catfish (Post 2375063)
Our governments are not at all the same. Does the US government commonly jail and execute groups of dissidents? Would the US government attempt to do the same to her if she set foot in our country like the Iranian regime would? Our governments are not the same and shame on her for saying otherwise.

Aktungbby 01-20-16 12:19 PM
AHHHH! the swept(under) carpet of history
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by August
Does the US government commonly jail and execute groups of dissidents?
Actually in answer to your query as queried: yes! and signed off by ol Honest Abe at that! Dr Mengele would have been proud too;
Quote:
Because of high demand for cadavers for anatomical study, several doctors wanted to obtain the bodies after the execution. The grave was reopened in the night and the bodies were distributed among the doctors, a practice common in the era. The doctor who received the body of Maȟpiya Akan Nažiŋ (Stands on Clouds), also known as "Cut Nose", was William Worrall Mayo. Mayo brought the body of Maȟpiya Akan Nažiŋ to Le Sueur, Minnesota, where he dissected it in the presence of medical colleagues. Afterward, he had the skeleton cleaned, dried and varnished. Mayo kept it in an iron kettle in his home office.
All to the good IMHO, the Mayo Clinic is one of the top rated medical facilities in the world!:woot:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dakota_War_of_1862 https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...ankatoMN38.JPGApproximately One-third of the Native Americans in the Owens Valley were forcibly relocated to Fort Tejon. After 1863, many returned to their permanent villages that had been established along creeks flowing down from the Sierra Nevada mountains...in the Manzanar area...after which, 1942, we moved in our Nipponese brethrenhttps://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...zanar_Flag.jpgOld Glory never waved more proudly!:03:...in either case?
Quote:
Let us review the main points of the debate. Over 120,000 residents of the U.S.A., two thirds of whom were American citizens, were incarcerated under armed guard. There were no crimes committed, no trials, and no convictions: the Japanese Americans were political incarcerees. To detain American citizens in a site under armed guard surely constitutes a "concentration camp." But what were the terms used by the government officials who were involved in the process and who had to justify these actions? Raymond Okamura provides us with a detailed list of terms. Let's consider three such euphemisms: "evacuation," "relocation," and "non-aliens." Earthquake and flood victims are evacuated and relocated. The words refer to moving people in order to rescue and protect them from danger. The official government policy makers consistently used "evacuation" to refer to the forced removal of the Japanese Americans and the sites were called "relocation centers." These are euphemisms (Webster: "the substitution of an inoffensive term for one considered offensively explicit") as the terms do not imply forced removal nor incarceration in enclosures patrolled by armed guards. The masking was intentional.
[wiki]

Oberon 01-20-16 12:42 PM
And before WWII but after the 1800s

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sedition_Act_of_1918

Betonov 01-20-16 12:47 PM
She may have meant that both goverments are full of old farts that abuse their wealth, power and things the population cares about (patriotism, religion, economy) to further their personal gains and goals without actual regard to practice what they preach themselves.

vienna 01-20-16 02:13 PM
Regarding the "relocation" of the Japanese-American citizens, there was a great divide between the Hawaiian Nisei and the mainland Nisei since their cultural viewpoint was different given their geographical differences. The Hawaiian Nisei were a substantially large portion of the islands' population and rather more integrated into the general populace; the mainland Nisei had a bit of a harder time and faced more racial discrimination. When the Hawaiian Nisei Army units were combined with the mainland units, fighting broke out between the two over the perception by the Hawaiians that the mainlanders were overly sensitive and intense. A white Army officer had a brilliant idea and arranged for the Hawaiians to accompany the manlanders when they went to visit their families being held in a "relocation center". Hawaiian Nisei and their families were not subject to "relocation" and were not aware of the extent of the imprisonment nor the conditions of the "detainees". Once the Hawaiians saw the camp, they fully understood the suppressed anger of the mainland soldiers and the internal squabbling ceased. Th Hawaiians were appalled by the situation; as some of them put it, if the purpose of the internment was to protect the Nisei, why were all the the machine guns in the guard towers pointed inwards instead of outwards?...


<O>

Platapus 01-20-16 04:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schroeder (Post 2374628)
^This.
Everything that gets us away from ME oil is good in my books.
I strongly disagree with this viewpoint.

Oil is a finite resource. To me it is much better using someone else's supply of a finite resource first. Then once their supply is gone, we still have our supply to use.. or to sell at the price we set.

This is especially attractive if we are using the finite resources owned by a country we don't particularly like. :D

August 01-20-16 08:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aktungbby (Post 2375272)
Actually in answer to your query as queried: yes! and signed off by ol Honest Abe at that! Dr Mengele would have been proud too
I would submit that if you need to go back a century and a half to find an example (which still pales in comparison to the ongoing excesses of the Iranian regime by the way) then it is not at all common.

August 01-20-16 08:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Betonov (Post 2375280)
She may have meant that both goverments are full of old farts that abuse their wealth, power and things the population cares about (patriotism, religion, economy) to further their personal gains and goals without actual regard to practice what they preach themselves.
And she would be correct but that is not what she said. Over simplification often leads to unintended meanings and one would think a writer would know better.

Aktungbby 01-20-16 11:06 PM
All over a search warrant?!!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by August (Post 2375351)
I would submit that if you need to go back a century and a half to find an example (which still pales in comparison to the ongoing excesses of the Iranian regime by the way) then it is not at all common.
Well I was bein' nice:D U didn't specify a time frame so ...WACO, 1993: 82 Branch Davidians: Thirty-three British citizens were among the members of the Branch Davidians during the siege; and 4 ATF agents. (16 wounded) All arrested and convicted Davidians had been released as of 2007. http://i1.wp.com/blog.newscom.com/wp...-explosion.jpg! Just as bad as the first two and time isn't really a factor anyway. Murder is murder. Normally I side with law enforcement; but not this mishandled mess. Considering that Timothy McVeigh cited the Waco incident as a primary motivation for the Oklahoma City bombing, his April 19, 1995 truck bomb attack that destroyed the Alfred P. Murrah Federal Building, a U.S. government office complex in downtown Oklahoma City, and destroyed or damaged numerous other buildings in the vicinity. The attack claimed 168 lives (including 19 children under the age of 6) and left over 600 injured. The whole avoidable business just rankles to this day.

August 01-21-16 08:27 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aktungbby (Post 2375386)
Well I was bein' nice:D U didn't specify a time frame so ...WACO, 1993: 82 Branch Davidians: Thirty-three British citizens were among the members of the Branch Davidians during the siege; and 4 ATF agents. (16 wounded) All arrested and convicted Davidians had been released as of 2007.
Go back and read my original statement. They didn't deliberately burn down that compound and it still pales by comparison. How many stonings has the Federal government ordered and carried out? Iran has carried out at least 150 since 1980. How many strangle hangings? How many 16 year old US girls are sentenced to this slow and torturous form of public execution? :nope:

I can go on so please just stop it AK, you know you're just grasping at straws here. The US government, for all it's warts and flaws is still leaps and bounds better than the Iranian regime on it's best day.

Aktungbby 01-21-16 01:24 PM
On the deadly nature of grasping at 5,243 straws.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by August
They didn't deliberately burn down that compound and it still pales by comparison. How many strangle hangings? AK, you know you're just grasping at straws here.
Well your point is not entirely invalid!:D As I've said before "All government is bad...the trick is to live where it is the least worst." (CHINA's worst imho) Mind, government is equally responsible for what it does and for what it does not do: add another total: The Tuskegee Institute has recorded 3,446 blacks and 1,297 whites being lynched between 1882 and 1968, with the annual peak occurring in the 1890s, at a time of economic stress in the South and political suppression. (Pretty strangly imho) A five-year study published by the Equal Justice Initiative in 2015 found that nearly 3,959 black men, women, and children were lynched in the twelve Southern states between 1877 and 1950. And it's not Minnesota Nice either( they made a postcard out of it!:nope: warning graphic) In Duluth, Minnesota, on June 15, 1920, three young African-American traveling circus workers were lynched after having been accused of having raped a white woman and jailed pending a grand jury hearing. A physician's subsequent examination of the woman found no evidence of rape or assault. The alleged "motive" and action by a mob were consistent with the "community policing" model. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lynching_in_the_United_States Throw in recent Chicago, Ferguson, Charlotte, Baltimore, and Oakland/San Francisco mishandled coverups and plainly nuthin' bad goes completely outta style...And we won't discuss the deaths by taser by government agents(police) which put the problem squarely within your more reasonable time constraint.
Quote:
According to data collected by Amnesty International, at least 500 people in the United States have died since 2001 after being shocked with Tasers either during their arrest or while in jail. Amnesty International recorded the largest number of deaths following the use of Tasers in California (92), "Of the hundreds who have died following police use of Tasers in the United States, dozens and possibly scores of deaths can be traced to unnecessary force being used," said Susan Lee, Americas program director at Amnesty International. "This is unacceptable, and stricter guidelines for their use are now imperative."
But hey maybe your right: all those dead people are just straw/chaff; But before I remove the speck from Iran's eye, (A lynch rope or taser is more humane than stones:timeout:) I generally like not to have a log in my own eye; but then again, that's probably another stupid Christian concept. :03: Matt 7:5

August 01-21-16 02:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aktungbby (Post 2375526)
Well your point is not entirely invalid!:D As I've said before "All government is bad...the trick is to live where it is the least worst." (CHINA's worst imho) Mind, government is equally responsible for what it does and for what it does not do: add another total: The Tuskegee Institute has recorded 3,446 blacks and 1,297 whites being lynched between 1882 and 1968, with the annual peak occurring in the 1890s, at a time of economic stress in the South and political suppression. (Pretty strangly imho) A five-year study published by the Equal Justice Initiative in 2015 found that nearly 3,959 black men, women, and children were lynched in the twelve Southern states between 1877 and 1950. And it's not Minnesota Nice either( they made a postcard out of it!:nope: warning graphic) In Duluth, Minnesota, on June 15, 1920, three young African-American traveling circus workers were lynched after having been accused of having raped a white woman and jailed pending a grand jury hearing. A physician's subsequent examination of the woman found no evidence of rape or assault. The alleged "motive" and action by a mob were consistent with the "community policing" model. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lynchi..._United_States Throw in recent Chicago, Ferguson, Charlotte, Baltimore, and Oakland/San Francisco mishandled coverups and plainly nuthin' bad goes completely outta style...And we won't discuss the deaths by taser by government agents(police) which put the problem squarely within your more reasonable time constraint. But hey maybe your right: all those dead people are just straw/chaff; But before I remove the speck from Iran's eye, (A lynch rope or taser is more humane than stones:timeout:) I generally like not to have a log in my own eye; but then again, that's probably another stupid Christian concept. :03: Matt 7:5
Again what you're talking about is a mixture of accidental deaths and criminal activity. None of it is state sanctioned. Remember we're talking about governments here not the actions of individuals.

But another comparison you might indeed make is how these incidents are made public. Unlike here there is no Freedom of Information act in Iran, no right to free speech, no right to protest, no BoR, nothing but what the mullahs allow them to have and what they allow them to know.


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