I really thought a short term deal would be reached, maybe not.

Both parties have spent us into this mess. The problem is many in the US see the elite getting ever richer why millions each year fall into poverty. Our middle class is being destroyed.

Indeed. Anyone who uses this situation as an excuse to rail only against Obama or the Democrats is a partisan hack not worth your time.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-0...-on-obama.html

We have a nasty system. Corporations keep moving jobs overseas and instead of investing in what jobs they could here, they invest in stock here and abroad. It's a big ponzi scheme to say less taxes for them creates jobs overhere, we gave them the big Bush cuts and they moved more jobs overseas, we gave them the tax holiday, cut jobs here and moved more overseas. It should be obvious with any profits, they will invest them abroad.

The more jobs we lose, the more people go into poverty and need social programs. The more jobs corporations make overseas, the more social help people will demand here. We'll, we can't afford them.

Fubar.

If the U.S. defaults, millions more will lose their jobs. Possibly me included.

So, I got an email from someone I know, a young MC rider, who asked me "By the way, what's your take on this? Maybe you can explain it to me a bit, sure doesn't seem like a good sign."

Here's my response, which I invite you (left & right wingers) to critique.

Neal, I think you're leaving out what made this country the greatest nation on earth, we built a strong middle class. How was this done, strong regulation that gave workers a fair shake, min wages, benefits, safety protections, breaking monoploies, fair tax codes, trade laws,..on and on.
We had the highest tax rates when we built the middle class and social services were low.

The problem with less regulation and taxes is we think the elite will do the right thing, it doesn't and hasn't worked that way in decades and won't in a global market. We did lessen regulations, tax cuts under Bush, trade laws, NAFTA, etc..told this would create mass jobs, it did the reverse. Study what happened the last corporate holiday, jobs were lost, profits were invested in stock here...no jobs created.

What it did was build and elite class where about 10% now hold 80% of all real wealth. Millions forced into poverty, no health insurance, etc. Both parties saw all the wealth going one direction, so the answer was more social services to keep americans calm why the rich got richer. Now the GOP wants to keep the rich richer and I assume use the herd mentality and let the poor die off. However, the number in poverty has now exceeded what can be paid. The answer, do what we did to create a strong middle class before, but sadly corporate america owns both parties now.

Many really do seem to believe the more breaks you give corporations, the more they will give back.

Our government failed us as the economy went global, instead of setting law to make a global economy work for us, they sold out to special interest and it now only works for a few. Neither party is addressing this, the GOP wants it to continue, so do the Dems, they just want the elite to pay for the social programs since they get so much favor to gain wealth.

Every leading economist, all extreme wealthy men like Gates, Buffet, Trump says our future will be a two class society. Many today still live a middle class life, but they do so in debt, they trust employers for med insurance, etc... Facts show another crisis could throw another 50 million americans into poverty. Studies say another 50 million will lose med insurance in the next decade, but the rich will get even richer. We even here some GOP members like Bachman that want to get rid of min. wage..

Instead of bringing back jobs here the correct way, by undoing all the mess that created the problem, the GOP is saying Americans must get down to the working levels in third world nations.
That we must accept $2 per hour, no benefits, no safety regulation, etc.. If congress isn't willing to bring back laws that keeps jobs here, then no matter what breaks you give corporations they will do business where they can the cheapest. It's very dangerous to use US wealth and assets creating stronger economies in nations that may one day want to run us over.

I also think it's a joke to say 50-60% of americans pay no taxes. They may not pay it through payroll, but the government gets it other ways. Before I became disabled, the last year I worked I was down to 70K a year. I kept records of all taxes I paid, FICA, property, gas tax, phone tax, sales tax, electric tax, etc... 42% of my income went to taxes... My guess is those numbers would hold down to 30K a year.

Just check, for every product or service you buy there will be a line somewhere with a tax included.

You're absolutely right. Anyone that parrots that "60% don't pay taxes" line is either ignorant or willfully trying to deceive you. Everyone who earns any income or purchases anything at all pays taxes. And the corporations pass their taxes on to you, the consumer:

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/07/26/bu...es-expire.html

Ah, I didn't say that.

Never a truer statement!

nail was struck on the heard Amistead. We can't expect to bring this country back from the brink with only a few holding so much wealth.

Just a minor point Neal - it's nothing to do with just the wealthy. Almost all of the Republican House have signed a pledge to never ever raise taxes in any circumstance. Closing loopholes etc is included in this. I'm strongly in agreement with Tom Friedman in saying this is an "abdication of their governing responsibilities in a period of incredibly rapid change and financial stress".

What is interesting is that in all the discussions in the media, there is little mention on the Federal Revenue.

Time is the only magazine I have been able to find that published the numbers indicating that, as a ratio of our GDP, Federal Revenue is the lowest it has been since the early 1950s.

This is why reports on the tax rate is misleading. Tax rates are only a place where tax laws and tax lawyers start from. With all the deductions and loopholes the effective tax rate is lower.

It was a most interesting and informative article in Time.

Before we start talking about raising taxes, perhaps we need to start closing the deductions/loopholes to raise the Federal Revenue at the same time we cut Federal Spending.

Too Late.
We assisted Japan and other Countries to do just that!
Then We passed Laws that allowed Jobs to pour out of the U.S.A.
all the while giveing huge breaks to the Companies that did just that.

Now it's getting close to 'Pay the Piper Time'.

they still think fo that as an increase. and any increases will have team R holing. :shifty:

Perhaps, this fiasco may convince people to vote for the person and not just the initial behind a candidate's name.

It really is time to get some adults in congress who are truly interested in running the country and not just party politics



:har::har::har::har::har::har::har:

Like that will ever happen in America. I kill myself sometimes.

Yea, I'll spend 100 Million for a Position that only pays what?
A Million a year for 4 years?
Think about that!

They like to freebase the power.:dead: They should pay all of those guys minimum wage and no benefits.

Hoo-Yeah, let's go even deeper in debt and print even more money! At the rate we're going, we'll all be rolling in dough, like this!

http://www.caseyresearch.com/sites/d...es/image23.jpg

It just pisses me off the Gov can print money.
But if I do it it's a Crime!!

My printers are pretty good!
:haha: