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You've both touched on some thoughts that have crossed my mind.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CDR Resser (Post 1606665)

Ducimus;

I have been following this thread with interest, as I am a fan of your work since Flavored to Taste. If I may, I would like to offer a suggestion. Perhaps instead of concentrating on a particular class of boat, instead focus on the career of one or two of the most interesting skippers in the various boats.

Most didn't command more than 1 or 2 classes of boats. I just imagine how interesting it would be to be put in the same situations as Creed Burlingame, Sam Dealy, Mush Morton, Dick O'Kane and others. Have a career structured to have the same patrol orders as some of the more famous skippers.

Perhaps this would be more of an extension to what you're planning. Either way, I look forward to anything else you decide to do with the game.

Just a thought, do with it what you will.

Thanks

Respectfully Submitted;
CDR Resser

I like this idea as well. The only problem I foresee with this is some skippers did a lot of lifeguard duty as well as other not so exciting things.

Also, one problem I think might be a problem is getting similar contacts as they had. Otherwise giving them the same orders wouldn't really be emulating there careers. (I think.)

Not meaning to bash this idea but hopefully build more ideas and solutions upon it.

I think a career game should feel like a journey.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ducimus (Post 1606702)

I think a career game should feel like a journey.

Exactly.

Similar orders, not necessarily identical results.

Respectfully Submitted;
CDR Resser

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ducimus (Post 1606635)

Gato. You know what I love? 4 possible refit configurations. What i hate? can't dive as deep as a balao.

Balao. The only thing i don't like, is it has the least refit options, and it comes later in the game. One conning tower type, and a late war start.

You have expressed my feelings exactly. :salute:

Problem I see with emulating a career is re-playability.
If you played it once, it`s basically the the same all the other times.
Unless of course there is some randomness build in.

A good balance between random and planned (scripted ?) events might be interesting though. :hmmm:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ducimus

S-boats: 56 (16.57%)
Porpoise: 21 (6.21%)
Salmon/Sargo: 31 (9.17%)
Tambor Gar: 31 ( 9.17%)
Gato:92( 27.22%)
Balao:107 (31.6%)

Ignoring the often gallant history associated with all the boat classes, my personal thoughts on them in context of within the game:

Lots of people love the S class. Personally? I strongly dislike them. To me they are the type 2's of the Uboat world - dugout canoes to be avoided.

The porpoise? With 4 forward and 2 aft, it smacks of a type 9 with a much shallower crush depth. *shrug* Why would i want that?

Salmon and sargo's. I do like the sargo's hull conning tower shape. But for some really weird reason, i have a problem with having as many tubes aft as i have in the bow. Why? I don't know, it just bugs me.

Tambor/Gar. Now we're talking! 4 aft, 6 bow. You can spit as many fish out your bow as a type 9 from both ends. The only fly in the ointment is the lower test and crush depth as compared to a gato... well... not REALLY. Reading a PDF from our local fleet boat expert from navsource, it would seem their really was no difference in crush depth between these boats and a gato. The only difference being a water tight bulkhead seperating the engine spaces.

Gato. You know what I love? 4 possible refit configurations. What i hate? can't dive as deep as a balao.

Balao. The only thing i don't like, is it has the least refit options, and it comes later in the game. One conning tower type, and a late war start.

All this rambeling, it leads me back to a point i should have made earlier.

- Some people derive pleasure from new commands. Going up the evolutionary pecking order from WW1 riveted rust bucket, to the Tench.

- Other people derive pleasure from commanding one boat through out the entire war. Watching that boat evolve technologically as the war progresses. ( I think i fall in this category)

- Other still, are probably a mix of the two.

Nice explanation of feelings for all boats :D I'm one of those who like S-Boats and perhaps I can clear a bit why :O:

Perhaps it's just some little masochist in me that likes the feeling that I'm the slowest, worst armed and armored thing that is moving in the sea. I'm required to be damn silent, hunt without being detected, I always need to think twice before I encounter anything, I always need to think where I waste my torpedos and I always need to fear that someone moves behind me where I can't do anything about it. Longest diving and surfacing times... yea but lowest periscope depth if I've understood right (which most likely is bad thing in some people's opinion)

Of course, the arcade gamer that lives in me hates the slow speed that requires turning time compression to +5000 in case I want to get a single mission done in a day.

Is there anything good then? May be that I've misunderstood something but my opinion is that they have the best deck gun in the game..

I've never felt myself comfortable in those "proper fleet boats", Tambor, Gato, Gar, Balao etc. I don't know why, it's awesome to let it fly with 6 fore torpedos and watch cruisers go down before they even realize that something attacked them. Then someone tries to circle around me and I'll let it fly with 4 aft torpedos and there it goes down to the waves. And still I feel uncomfortable.. :hmmm:

Unfortunately you can't play trough the war with S-boat. It's "take a balao or retire" :damn:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Istar (Post 1606772)

Problem I see with emulating a career is re-playability.
If you played it once, it`s basically the the same all the other times.
Unless of course there is some randomness build in.

Agreed.

Hey I think I remember this being talked about a while back in the TMO thread in the mod section.

For what it's worth Duci I am one of those S-18 nuts (also like starting with the type 2b) just to appreciate the later models.

But the way I see it, your name is practically a brand name here at subsim. With as much fun as I have had with TMO I will no doubt try this mod out simply because I know the quality will be tops. I imagine alot of people feel that way.

And because of that I would say go for. Who knows the mod might evolve into something as popular or more so even than TMO.

Just my .0187654 cents (inflation)

I voted number two. That said I am not one to try to go through the whole war from a rustbucket to a shiny wondersub. I like to play careers as different captains in different periods of the war and try to survive and do the best I can no matter what the situation. So I don't care about amassing a humongous score by 1945 having fought from the Philippines to Tokyo Bay.

Some of us like single missions as well to try out stuff. In SHIII I never tried a career with a Type XXI but had fun with the single mission.

Think this might be something cool you could use Duci...

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...=1#post1608312

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ducimus (Post 1603433)

How about a Tambor will 4 conning tower refits instead of a gato? Or is it all about the gato? In gameplay terms, the main difference between the two is diving depth.
(edit: admittidy, mission wise, the Gato is easier. I'm perplexed as to how the hell would I handle Dec 7th as a starting date. )

I would love a well done Tambor class that could be used from the start of the war to the finish. One thing I hate in campaign mode is if you keep refusing offers for new boats is they eventually retire you. Sucks when you get an offer for a new boat, turn it down and end up at a desk. Love to keep a Tambor the entire war. You mention keeping a boat through the war, I've never been able to, seems about the 3 or 4th offer that's turned down gets me retired. Seems I'm usually in a S boat or Sargo.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Krauter (Post 1608340)

Think this might be something cool you could use Duci...

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...=1#post1608312

:o

Oh my. I see a huge number of open doors.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve (Post 1602724)

Both ideas sound good to me, but I like the less-travelled road, like S-boats and V-boats, so I voted many "pretty good" ones over one "perfect" boat.

I second Steve.

I did a little work on the Narwhal, I love the V-Boats.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Krauter (Post 1608340)

Think this might be something cool you could use Duci...

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...=1#post1608312

How would this be used for SH4? I mean, would one be able to make a substantial change to the game engine code, or would it be only tinkering and mucking about in the dark, so to speak?

Quote:

Originally Posted by TorpX (Post 1608696)

How would this be used for SH4? I mean, would one be able to make a substantial change to the game engine code, or would it be only tinkering and mucking about in the dark, so to speak?

If I'm reading it correctly, it could be used to make major functionality changes to the engine. The stuff that couldn't be dealt with because it was hard coded.

I love the S-boats, however the problem I have with them in game is that none of them in 41-42 had a radar or a TDC fire control computer. So sitting in the control room and seeing the radar screen or going to the scope and seeing the TDC kills the immersion for me.

The Balao is the best, but comes in the latter part of the war.

To me, the sweet spot is the Tambor or Gato class. They were there for most of the war, have 10 torpedo tubes and the latest TDC. Sure, they may not dive as deep as a Balao, but in SH4, it is a very rare event when you have to dive deeper than 400 feet.