For me, what Killed DW it was the MOD frenzy (tell me I am wrong please).
OK i can be an ahole, the modders put a lot of work on the code.

I can barely evaluate the result of the modding as i quitted after the very first versions of Mods appeared.



As a programmer (little experience ok), I can state that DW is a HIGH QUALITY product.

I think the over-complexity is what really killed DW off it just was way too in-depth for the mass market in the same way as Shuttle was many years ago on the Amiga. The general populace does not have the patience to set out patterns of sonobuoys tune in to them and and patiently wait for results. Red Storm Rising had much the same theme as DW but was massively successful in its day, it wasn't a high fidelity sim but it was a good game and I think that made the difference. DW was a good sim but not a particularly good game.

Also Sonalysts DW manual was good at explaining how to do things but not why you would do them. I think the original 688 Hunter Killer manual from EA did a much better job of hand holding the new player into the game.

I dont think people waited for DW to hit the bargain bin there simply were not enough people willing to invest the time it required to learn such a complex sim. It certainlly wasn't a marketing issue either I think Sonalysts bent over backwards to push the game in the marketplace.

i dont have exact figures but i know steam does bargain things on a weekly basis and the discounts vary but they reduce prices and that induces buying by people who might overlook it at full price and doing this actually increased profits. enough extra people bought it at the discounted price to offset the loss from the discount. itll be interesting to see what happens with the 'pay what you want' experiment.

for example...

18th August 2009 11:51PM, posted by JWhittaker
I just purchased this with no problems, so it would seem that if they were having trouble with the website, they have it sorted out now. Maybe it just got overloaded with everyone trying to buy it at once. Anyway, £2.51, a great price for any game. I wouldn't normally buy a game like this, but at that price, who wouldn't???

Will This Be Worth Buying a New PC?
 

After having watching the trailer in German, the answer is "maybe". My PC is 6 years old, and runs fine for the games I play. In this case, Ubisoft is shooting for the moon, so if I wanna get this one, a new PC will be required.

You are right, :)

I think you believe this forum to be more important in the scheme of things than it actually is, Neal. I believe that when it comes to total sales, the percentage represented here is not that great at all. When it comes to valuable input for the Devs....that's a different story.

If a few like me wait 9 months to buy the game...big deal. If Ubisoft was to actually produce a finished game for once then we'd all be happy. Who knows, they might surprise us.

After all aren't "bug's" a sort of increase of the realism ?? (lol)

I mean, in what machinery do you never have unexpected failures ?

i.e. fire torpedo tube 1 - torpedo tube doesn't open Sir !

:O:

Yeah, but there's a difference between a few bugs and fixes which you'd expect with any complex game release and the 'shove it out there and patch it later' attitude of this Publisher. I draw a distinct line between the Publisher and their Devs.

On the other hand, I guess that a category of bugs can be really hard to explore, the hardware-driven bugs (too many poss configurations).

For the rest, don't they listen at the beta-testers ?

I must choose my words very carefully. In my experience the answer to your question is 'No'. Again, I would differentiate between the publisher and the Devs here. The Devs welcome external Beta Teasters. The Publisher does not.

You know, understandably, some folks take a 'walking on egg shells' attitude with Ubisoft because they are the only publisher out there making sub sims. I understand that, but there's nothing wrong with legitimate criticizm of a publisher that has a terrible reputation accross the board for the quality control of its games.

Here's a recent quote from console game users:

'Members on the official Ubisoft forum harshly criticized the company for the lack of quality control and accusing Ubisoft of breaking its own promise of "significantly better" Wii projects.' Ubisoft has acknowledged that it's console game quality control standards were too low and needed addressing.

So to the egg shell walkers, here's the point.... Ubisoft continues the Silent Hunter franchise as a Business decision. Nothing more and nothing less. The Silent Hunter franchise doesn't make a huge amount of money, but it is profitable for Ubisoft. The U Boat sims have proved more profitable than the Fleet Boat sims and that is the sole reason that Silent Hunter 5 is set back in the Atlantic during WWII.

I guarantee you that Silent Hunter 5 will be as unfinished as Silent Hunter 4 was at release. If that's Ok with you and you're happy to patch and install and uninstall mods for 6 to 9 months then I respect that. I will wait for the game to be patched to 1.4, at which time it will be in the state that it should have been at when it was released.

If things are really that serious, I can imagine as a result a thinning of the subsimmers community over time... :shifty:

The whole thing is a Catch 22, as I tried to explain before. We the consumers have seen Ubisoft release the previous two installments in the series before they were market ready. I myself bought SH3 and 4 when they were released. But after installing SH4, I shelved it for at least a year!

So here's the Catch 22. Past experience leads us to believe that this installment will be just as unfinished as the previous, so therefore some will not jump to buy it. However, because some choose not to buy it based on past experience with the company, the sales numbers will reflect that. And whatever the numbers reflect is what will Ubisoft perceive as the "market" for such a product. It will never cross their mind that consumers might be a little upset about past dealings, it simply doesn't fit into their business model. Plain and simple. :know:

I don't even know why they are making a SH 5. It must be a way to make a quick buck every two to three years. I'll take it though hehe.

I don't actually agree with your assesment. The total number of members of forums such as this represent less than ten percent of total sales of the product. The very small number of that percentage who will either delay their purchase or not purchase at all is an insignificant number in respect to total sales.

The vast majority here will purchase the game, and the Devs will get excellent feedback from some of us here. The real issue is the ninety plus percent of sales who are not members of forums like this and who are purchasing the game as a 'go to sea and sink stuff' game. Those are the guys that Ubisoft is interested in.

Ok im with ya on this so far. If 1% of the target audience doesn't buy the game, no big loss for Ubi. I'll agree there.

This one is a little harder to chew on. It would be hard to get Ubi to come out and say who they are targeting for this game. But at the same time can we really assume that this is being marketed more as an arcade than a sub sim? If you (and by you I mean anyone) judge this game based solely off of the cinematic trailer than you're nuts. For those who are familiar or may have seen it, take for example World of Warcraft. Blizzard came out with some phenomenal cinematic trailers, but that's all they were, cinematics. Don't get me wrong I'm excited over a SH5, even if it is U-boats. But I think some people are falling victim to rubber neck syndrome and aren't watching out for the crash that's about to happen in front of them.

I'm still getting sweaty palms playing with SH3 GWX + mods...even after all these years...

I bought SH4 for it's Pacific War theater...not playing it yet but eagerly waiting for the GWX team to do their miracles...

Will I buy SH5?

Yes...but only AFTER the GWX gods says they're gonna work on it.

Ubisoft should be paying GWX and all the Modders product makeover fees.

:yep:

Day 1 purchase... or pre-order. :hmmm:

We complained/suggested, they listened;


I've seen all these points requested on the 2 or 3 threads that sprung up on SH5 after the first rumors. They have earned my support, waiting to buy untill it hits the bargain bin would be condemning SH to death. At least it would certainly feel like that to me. :(

Unless you want the blood of Silent Hunter on your hands, you will buy this, and you will pay good money for it! :arrgh!: ;)

Wolfpacks? Anyone?

"Do not spoil what you have by desiring which you have not; but remember that what you have now was once among the things you only hoped for." --Epicurus
:salute:

I've preordered both SH3 and 4, and I have a feeling it'll be no different with this one. Call me gullible!