SUBSIM Radio Room Forums - [REL] Historically accurate 4-Bladed propellers for all Subs

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- - [REL] Historically accurate 4-Bladed propellers for all Subs (https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=129439)

:sunny:

[edit] There's one but... The .zon file needs to be corrected as well. Moving the visual object (3D model) requires the SH3ZonesCtrl to be swapped as well. I think the easiest way to do this is by swapping the parent id's between the two controllers that are linked to the props. Also, I have no idea what the effect of a broken prop is (iow. the wrong prop may be broken). I suggest one of you tests this out before making this change across all submarines...

That, or investigate other (better?) ways of changing rotation direction... I have no other ideas though...

Quote:

Originally Posted by andycaccia

I tested the Gato class with the X offset inverted and It looks fine. Did not touch anything else at the moment. I will change all subs when I have a free minute (penal law is hard to study:88) )...

Canonicus, are you sure you swapped the right offset values? My changes are OK, on the gato class at least..

Yes...I had to make the "XZ" swap after I noticed that the ends of the prop shafts, where they enter the subs hull, were sticking out and not aligned properly with the stern tubes.

I had to do this for the Porpoise class only.

Gato, Balao... looked fine.

Cheers!

well done ;) but if you just invert, then the 3dmodel will be wrong lol (blades pitch not correct...)

Perhaps I'm having a bad hair day, I cant seem to find the dl link for this mod covering all sub props, I dont see a link for it

Quote:

Originally Posted by kapitan_zur_see

Hi, mates :arrgh!:

Okay some of you already read that... but for the newcommers:

Hi captains! :arrgh!:

Following some very stubborned attempts at importing a 3dmodel inside SH4 and making its texture to work, i've finally made it :know:
I've had to deal with certain restrictions so as for now, it doesn't quite match the level of quality we'll be able to reach in a near future, especially regarding how light reacts on the model... But can't say i'm quite proud :rotfl:Skwasjer will know why lol :lol:

Ok, as some of you may already knows, US submarines of that era were using 4 blades propellers during war instead of the 3 blades one the devs modelled. So i've modelled one myself and got it retextured. Propellers have now their own separate texture also instead of sharing a tiny part of the hull general texture (hence very low-res).

Subs included are Tambor, Gato, Balao, Porpoise, Salmon and Sargo class
However, for now on, i've not included S-Class subs since i doubt they were fitted with such propellers (being rather used as old training platforms, i think)

Features:

New 3D 4-bladed propeller model
Hi-res texture (1024x1024) for best close-up details
Correct pitch for left and right propellers (fix vanilla model)
100% ROW compatible

After/Before screenies (previous lower-res version)

http://img212.imageshack.us/img212/3033/4bladevl8.jpg

It's 100% latest ROW COMPATIBLE. All you have to do is installing it AFTER ROW (or ROW would overwrite it...). Use JSGME...

...CLICK ON THE PROPELLERS TO DOWNLOAD...

4Shared.com Megaupload.com Rapidshare.com

http://img441.imageshack.us/img441/5729/propvy6.jpg http://img441.imageshack.us/img441/5729/propvy6.jpg http://img441.imageshack.us/img441/5729/propvy6.jpg

Have fun using this!
Special thanks for Skwas and his fantastic S3D

You need to click one of the three prop pictures under the server you want to download from.

And the X swap is only a band aid for the problem. As I've said, the props are mounted and pitched correctly the way they are, it just so happens that Ubi made the shafts spin the wrong way.

However, since the direction of shaft rotation does not change when the props are swapped, is there a way to swap the shafts instead of the props? Or maybe swap the engines/motors or something? That said, does anyone know what code determines the direction of the props/shafts?

Direction of spin is determined 2 ways.
Which side of center is it on
and is it forwards or behind center
Center being determined by the X position for left to right,
Z position for front to back.

Also note that if a prop goes above surface of water?
It counter rotates.

Alright, so long story short, is there a way to get the props spinning the right directions?

I will second that !

Left Propeller to run counterclockwise and the right one clockwise,will fix the glitch.
link for new down-load desired______________:roll: Now that we are back in port for Refit.

one of the annoying things that got under my skin

good job on the fix

I don't know if it was mentioned, but at full/flank speed, the shafts spin the correct direction in reference to the pitch of the props, however, at lower speed settings, they reverse. So at 1/3, they're spinning like if you were in 1/3 reverse, not forward. So I don't think reverseing the props X or Z or XZ would really help, as it seems to be a core coding issue. You'd have to be able to determine the rotation at all telegraph settings.

My .02

Car wheels spin backwards as well at high speed. I don't know if the RPM at flank speed could do the same to the way the human eye/brain interprets motion. But I also haven't looked at the issue ingame. Is only the shaft rotating incorrectly, or both the shaft and prop?

I thought of this as well. I'll have to double check when I get home, but when I noticed it, I was only looking at the prop, not the shaft.

I'd like to see what happens if I swap the Rotation XZ and/or YZ in the node...
maybe we'll correct the wrong rotation of propellers instead of "PATCHING" the problem by inverting the propeller blades. Since the props were correct and the rotation was wrong.

Quote:

Left Propeller to run counterclockwise and the right one clockwise,will fix the glitch.

If wrong Rotation values are responsible of this BUG I guess it will be easily fixed...I hope...:hmm:

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbt308

It's because the props are making more than one revolution per frame at high speed, so they appear to be going backwards. Same thing happens if you shine a strobe light at a fan and adjust the frequency of flashes.

And yes, both the shafts and props spin the wrong direction.

By reading privateers post, the following may work. (again, theory!!!)

I think all you have to do is move the models in a 3D studio (ie. 3DSMax), and then make the X-swap in S3D (only remove or add sign!!). For instance, say left prop in S3D sits at X = -0.15, move the model in 3D studio by doubling this figure (-0.3), then in S3D move it to positive X-axis, at 0.15 (remove the sign). The result is -0.3 (model moved) + 0.3 (difference of X-change in S3D) = 0.0 so the model hasn't technically moved. The world offset is still ok, but the local offset is now positive to the game, "hopefully" resulting in an opposite rotation.

The same for right prop, but reversed.

The best person to test this is kapitan_zur_see, since he imported the models in the first place and has the sources and 3D studio to do it in.

[edit] changed description, I made a mistake (I made a dozen or so edits, lol)

mmm...
Interesting theory, skwas :hmm:
I'll try that. Not that i'm not occupied with that Narwhal modelling...;)

Must... have... correct... props... :smug: Now get to it you lazy bast :rotfl:

[edit] I'm not sure why I said the pitch would be screwed after doing that though. As the model would still sit at the correct spot. Even the zones don't have to be changed!

This could have been intentional on the dev side to imitate the RPM induced illusion.
Any spinning object will have a speed at which it begins to appear it's rotation is reversed.
Just an observation from an old automotive guy.

Excellent looking props! :|\\

Kapitan, do you think you could get us retextured 3-bladers and high resolution cavitation bubbles (who else is sick of those milky clouds emanating from the props?)? If you can get around to it sometime, that is.

oh my...! :ahoy:
got plenty of work to do now! lol :dead:
I'll see what i can do, but 'im focusing on modelling the Narwhal as for now (i believe it could be highly prioritized regarding the anticipation :hmm:)